Tangled magnetic fields power cosmic particle accelerators

Tangled magnetic fields power cosmic particle accelerators
SLAC researchers have found a new mechanism that could explain how plasma jets emerging from the center of active galaxies, like the one shown in this illustration, accelerate particles to extreme energies. Computer simulations (circled area) showed that tangled magnetic field lines create strong electric fields in the direction of the jets, leading to dense electric currents of high-energy particles streaming away from the galaxy. Credit: Greg Stewart/SLAC National Accelerator Laboratory

Magnetic field lines tangled like spaghetti in a bowl might be behind the most powerful particle accelerators in the universe. That's the result of a new computational study by researchers from the Department of Energy's SLAC National Accelerator Laboratory, which simulated particle emissions from distant active galaxies.

At the core of these active galaxies, launch high-speed jets of plasma—a hot, ionized gas—that shoot millions of light years into space. This process may be the source of cosmic rays with energies tens of millions of times higher than the energy unleashed in the most powerful manmade .

"The mechanism that creates these extreme particle energies isn't known yet," said SLAC staff scientist Frederico Fiúza, the principal investigator of a new study that will publish tomorrow in Physical Review Letters. "But based on our simulations, we're able to propose a new mechanism that can potentially explain how these cosmic particle accelerators work."

The results could also have implications for plasma and nuclear fusion research and the development of novel high-energy particle accelerators.

Simulating cosmic jets Researchers have long been fascinated by the violent processes that boost the energy of cosmic particles. For example, they've gathered evidence that shock waves from powerful star explosions could bring particles up to speed and send them across the universe.

These movies show how distortions of the helical magnetic field of a cosmic jet (center) generate a strong electric field in the jet direction (left). The electric field boosts the energy of charged particles, effectively creating a dense electric current along the jet (right). Credit: arXiv:1810.05154v1

Scientists have also suggested that the main driving force for cosmic plasma jets could be magnetic energy released when in plasmas break and reconnect in a different way—a process known as "."

However, the new study suggests a different mechanism that's tied to the disruption of the helical generated by the supermassive black hole spinning at the center of active galaxies.

"We knew that these fields can become unstable," said lead author Paulo Alves, a research associate working with Fiúza. "But what exactly happens when the magnetic fields become distorted, and could this process explain how particles gain tremendous energy in these jets? That's what we wanted to find out in our study."

Tangled magnetic fields power cosmic particle accelerators
Composite image of the active galaxy Centaurus A, showing lobes and jets extending millions of light years into space. Credit: Optical: ESO/WFI; Submillimeter: MPIfR/ESO/APEX/A.Weiss et al.; X-ray: NASA/CXC/CfA/R.Kraft et al.

To do so, the researchers simulated the motions of up to 550 billion particles—a miniature version of a cosmic jet—on the Mira supercomputer at the Argonne Leadership Computing Facility (ALCF) at DOE's Argonne National Laboratory. Then, they scaled up their results to cosmic dimensions and compared them to astrophysical observations.

From tangled lines to high-energy particles The simulations showed that when the helical magnetic field is strongly distorted, the magnetic field lines become highly tangled and a large electric field is produced inside the jet. This arrangement of electric and magnetic fields can, indeed, efficiently accelerate electrons and protons to extreme energies. While high-energy electrons radiate their energy away in the form of X-rays and gamma rays, protons can escape the jet into space and reach the Earth's atmosphere as cosmic radiation.

"We see that a large portion of the released in the process goes into high-energy , and the acceleration mechanism can explain both the high- radiation coming from active galaxies and the highest cosmic-ray energies observed," Alves said.

Tangled magnetic fields power cosmic particle accelerators
In simulations of a miniature version of a cosmic jet, SLAC researchers have found that when the jet’s helical magnetic field (left) is strongly distorted, the magnetic field lines become highly tangled (middle), producing a large electric field (right) inside the jet that can efficiently accelerate electrons and protons to extreme energies. Credit: arXiv:1810.05154v1

Roger Blandford, an expert in black hole physics and former director of the SLAC/Stanford University Kavli Institute for Particle Astrophysics and Cosmology (KIPAC), who was not involved in the study, said, "This careful analysis identifies many surprising details of what happens under conditions thought to be present in distant jets, and may help explain some remarkable astrophysical observations."

Next, the researchers want to connect their work even more firmly with actual observations, for example by studying what makes the radiation from cosmic jets vary rapidly over time. They also intend to do lab research to determine if the same mechanism proposed in this study could also cause disruptions and particle acceleration in fusion plasmas.


Explore further

Missing gamma-ray blobs shed new light on dark matter, cosmic magnetism

More information: Efficient Nonthermal Particle Acceleration by the Kink Instability in Relativistic Jets, arXiv:1810.05154 [astro-ph.HE] arxiv.org/abs/1810.05154
Journal information: Physical Review Letters

Citation: Tangled magnetic fields power cosmic particle accelerators (2018, December 13) retrieved 17 October 2019 from https://phys.org/news/2018-12-tangled-magnetic-fields-power-cosmic.html
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Dec 13, 2018
Theres that darned electroplasma stuff again.

Dec 13, 2018
It has been obvious that the jets were electromagnetic, relativists are slow to adapt.

Now the question is can they apply whatever theory they come up with to the stars and planets, also known to exhibit (not as powerful) jets

Dec 13, 2018
It has been obvious that the jets were electromagnetic, relativists are slow to adapt.

Now the question is can they apply whatever theory they come up with to the stars and planets, also known to exhibit (not as powerful) jets


@Scroofinator:
We have evidence of astrophysical jets from planets? Got a link to that?

Dec 13, 2018
It has been obvious that the jets were electromagnetic, relativists are slow to adapt.


Errrr, yes, we knew. And what have relativists got to do with it?

Dec 13, 2018
@691Boat
Well, not relativistic jets, but "plumes".
https://phys.org/...ere.html

But they have been observed in planetary nebulae
http://iopscience...504/meta


Dec 13, 2018
And what have relativists got to do with it

How long did we try to associate this phenomenon to gravity?

Dec 13, 2018
And what have relativists got to do with it

How long did we try to associate this phenomenon to gravity?


It is due to gravity, basically! What do you think a black hole is? The jets themselves are the result of the twisting of the magnetic field around this massive object.

Dec 13, 2018
@Scroofinator:
You understand that planetary nebulae are not actually planets, right?
Regarding the "plume" following Earth, is that "plume" being accelerated like the original article discusses?


Dec 13, 2018
Well, it did not take very long for them to come up with an extremely widespread, very solid finding of Electric Currents and the Magnetic Fields associated with them which appear to mostly come from the dust and gas torus, through turbulence during the feeding process, creating the very dense and twisted toroidal magnetic field which augments and focuses the polar magnetic field of the Back Hole giving rise to the jets which continue holding themselves together via the magnetic field as well as acting as an extremely efficient Particle Accelerator.

REALLY hard for you to deny this when they talk directly about electric field, charge zones with the resulting magnetic fields which reinforce one-another. MS science recently has found disc-star magnetic interactions that accounts for the jets, they show how jets, tori and fields interact to form both planetary systems and galaxies.

it is NOT ALL GRAVITY, as magnetism is stronger than gravity and Massive jets escape the SMBHs!

Dec 13, 2018
For years I've pointed out (to Phys-1, RNP etc) that these accretion-disc-polar-jet systems create orders-of-magnitude MORE powerful 'accelerators' than manmade LHC etc; and that material being entrained/deconstructed/ejected as Quark-Gluon plasma which then REFORMS into 'pristine-looking' hydrgen/helium; which is why ALL BB-related interpretations are SUSPECT/MISLEADING; because 'pristine/primordial-looking' stuff is ALWAYS BEING REFORMED from RECYCLED energy-matter via 'systems' like these; hence making all BB-based 'calculations/expectations (ie, "BB-nucleosynthesis estimates" etc etc) INVALID and MISLEADING.

I recall @RNP recently attacked/dismissed me when I again reminded of the KNOWN SCIENCE that HUMONGOUS quantities/ejection of Q-G Plasma/PROTONS etc was acknowledged by mainstream to constantly flow back to deep inter-galactic/inter-gal-cluster space; and so backing up MY points made!

ps: So, RNP etc, will you NOW STOP attacking me due to your OWN ignorance?

Dec 13, 2018
I should clarify that magnetism and electromagnetism are stronger than gravity only in some situations. Obviously there is a clear effect of gravity, and folks like RC and I are not denying this.

The effects of plasma and current are everywhere, however they are especially stronger when you get such Extreme Events such as in-feeding at a SMBH, and this article is great proof of that.

These jets, quasar jets we know of, can travel megaparsecs, and stay coherent. This means they continue to maintain a magnetic field/electron flow/proton flux and cooling into an ion flux, atomic gasses and molecular gasses as they cool that will later form the clouds of cold gas needed for the formation of globular clusters in places of remnant charge densities.

With the cold gas, the remnant magnetic fields slow down the gravitational inflow so as to allow the material to accrete into the star and torus system which then provides charge to the magnetism in place, via initial jet then solar wind.

Dec 13, 2018
Scroofinator misses the point a little bit with "Planetary Nebulae" as in the beginning of modernish astronomy, the magnification and back-knowledge was not so great, and people first thought that these Nebulae must come from other Planets, since stars were known to be tiny objects very far away that affected nothing here.

Then we find that those tiny little stars out there are like our Sun, some much bigger, most smaller, with wide variation between, and they do funny things like blow up or blow off surface layers, and make these circular-with-jet-looking critters when they explode, at times, in Supernovae.

But that is not the same as an actual planet giving forth such plumes. In fact, we see the opposite effect in particles streaming INTO our Planet's energy system; Incoming Ions (largely oxygen and nitrogen ions) streaming in along higher zones of magnetism and seen as Northern Lights as their remaining electrons and virtual electrons shower and dazzle us with photons.

Dec 13, 2018
@Scroofinator:
You understand that planetary nebulae are not actually planets, right?
Regarding the "plume" following Earth, is that "plume" being accelerated like the original article discusses?

says 691Boat

IIRC, the Earth has been/is losing a certain portion of its Oxygen gas to outer space. I believe it was in a physorg article not long ago. The 02 might be combining with another gas or gases, and both/all could be integrated into the plume from Earth. I will search for that article.

Dec 13, 2018
SEU, primarily we lose hydrogen and helium, although some oxygen will get by as well it is much less in volume to the hydrogen ions and helium ions in the magnetotail of the planet.

Dec 13, 2018
I understand, Steelworlf. But here is the link anyway.

https://phys.org/...ere.html

Dec 13, 2018
Mebbe the holy books should all read that "God in his Infinite Wisdom instituted a Grand Recycling System"

One such that 'Big Bang' and SMBH Jet Disassociation of matter and expansion into the Universe are pretty much one in the same, and with us finding supermassive galactic clusters back at least 12B+ yrs ago, argues for 'this universe' to have been existing a lot longer than that.

Cosmic Background Radiation, clumpy as it is, with it's hot and cold spots comparatively, can be from static, ongoing, very far away recycling done though SMBHs, and I would even wager that there is an upper limit to the size of galaxies and galaxy clusters before they actually implode from massive radiation pressure due to closely co-orbiting SMBHs in the range of trillions of stellar mass, each, and perhaps a dozen of these objects in one 'small' area.

Would likely appear to be similar to a 'Blazar' and obscured in it's own brightness and should be distinguishable from a Quasar jet face on.

Dec 13, 2018
In fact, Blazars showing such periodicity of apparent multiple objects like in this article:

https://phys.org/...408.html

May well be the sort of thing to look for as far as a 'Hyper-Blazar' of a section of the universe having too much matter/energy in it had HAS to dispense with it. There may be a background gravity signal from such even, but in such conditions, a super dense cloud pushing all directions with radiation pressure, SHOULD be enough 'ram pressure' to actually form some of the hyper-massive stars that have been theorized.

I would think that when the extreme radiation pressure subsides that these would either fracture into globular clusters or go HyperNova and produce more SMBH's to go shooting farther out into the Universe via gravitational slinging. Most globular clusters would join the local disc via gas-lane feeling and gravitational in-spiralling moderated by magnetic fields and radiation pressure.

Dec 13, 2018
"But based on our simulations, we're able to propose a new mechanism that can potentially explain how these cosmic particle accelerators work."

Hmmm, how'd they do it?

From the paper;
"In this Letter, we present the results of threedimensional (3D), particle-in-cell (PIC) simulations that reveal for the first time how the self-consistent development of the internal KI in relativistic magnetized jets results in the efficient acceleration of nonthermal particles. We find that the emergence of highly tangled magnetic fields and a large-scale electric field throughout the kink-unstable region promotes rapid energization of the particles up to the confinement energy of the jet."

Who'da thunk it, not a MHD simulation to be seen. And the plasmoid which creates these jets is created in the same way, twisting electric currents. Keep in mind, the only way to create these twisted helical fields in electric currents, the only way.

Dec 14, 2018
Electrical and magnetic fields drive our universe

It's about time we moved on since Isaac formulated gravity 330yrs ago
it is one of many forces
it is not the only force
as in the world
of electron and protons
gravity is the non existent force
almosts as if it does not exist
and at centre of mass
it actually does not exist
as
the only force
the force that drives atomic forces
the force that holds this universe together
the force that supports the atoms that enables us to walk tall
the force that separates are feet from the ground under foot
the electric force
and the magnetic force
is what drives this universe
in current, in electric field, in magnetic field
and
spectacularly in billions of volts of electric lightning discharge
driving millions of magnetic fields of tesla
Our electric magnetic universe
E.M.U



Dec 14, 2018
And the plasmoid which creates these jets is created in the same way, twisting electric currents. Keep in mind, the only way to create these twisted helical fields in electric currents, the only way.


There is no plasmoid, idiot. This is a simulation based on what happens around a massive black hole! No black hole, no jet.

Observations of bright knots in AGN jets (e.g. the well-studied HST-1 in M87) suggest that efficient particle acceleration may be taking place at distances of 10 pc to 1 kpc from the black hole central engine.


https://arxiv.org...5154.pdf


Dec 14, 2018
There is no plasmoid, idiot. This is a simulation based on what happens around a massive black hole! No black hole, no jet.

Completely false, these simulations have zero to do with the origin of the jets. The simulations are explicitly related to the jets and the electric currents flowing through them, the relevance to the BH is only assumed. Besides, there is no relevant mechanism that shows how a BH creates jets, it is even mentioned as such. Plasmoids on the other hand certainly create jets and are a natural result of the electric currents driving the system. jonesdumb is wearing his ass hat again.

Dec 14, 2018
There is no plasmoid, idiot. This is a simulation based on what happens around a massive black hole! No black hole, no jet.

Completely false, these simulations have zero to do with the origin of the jets. The simulations are explicitly related to the jets and the electric currents flowing through them, the relevance to the BH is only assumed. Besides, there is no relevant mechanism that shows how a BH creates jets, it is even mentioned as such. Plasmoids on the other hand certainly create jets and are a natural result of the electric currents driving the system. jonesdumb is wearing his ass hat again.


Total crap. The jets cannot form without the BH.

Dec 14, 2018
Total crap. The jets cannot form without the BH.

Show your claim empirically, which you obviously cannot. All you have is maths gymnastics, nothing empirical to be seen.
It however can show numerous laboratory and in situ observations which show plasmoids do in fact create jets. It can also be shown the entire observed life cycle of galaxies from newly born AGN's through to giant elliptical galaxies based upon interacting plasmoids. You cannot do so without invoking faerie dust and impossible physics defying magic.

Dec 14, 2018
It can also be shown the entire observed life cycle of galaxies from newly born AGN's through to giant elliptical galaxies based upon interacting plasmoids


No, it cannot, and nobody in their right mind would believe such idiocy.

SOURCES OF RELATIVISTIC JETS IN THE GALAXY
https://arxiv.org...2062.pdf

Not a mention of the idiotic plasmoid woo. And since when have you been interested in empirical evidence? Where is the empirical evidence that Earth used to orbit Saturn? Or that the Sun is a giant lightbulb? Etc, etc.


Dec 14, 2018
You understand that planetary nebulae are not actually planets, right?
Regarding the "plume" following Earth, is that "plume" being accelerated like the original article discusses?

Yes but planets are being formed within them, where there's smoke there's fire...

And the plume's are accelerated out of the poles, not out the back like a tail, and if you would have read the linked article you would have known that

Dec 14, 2018
Total crap. The jets cannot form without the BH

Explain netron stars and pulsars then, I'll wait...

Dec 14, 2018
Total crap. The jets cannot form without the BH

Explain netron stars and pulsars then, I'll wait...


Which can also form jets. You'll find that the EU idiots also don't believe they exist, either! Read the paper I linked to.

Dec 14, 2018
You understand that planetary nebulae are not actually planets, right?
Regarding the "plume" following Earth, is that "plume" being accelerated like the original article discusses?

Yes but planets are being formed within them, where there's smoke there's fire...


Lol. No they are not!
https://en.wikipe...y_nebula


Dec 14, 2018
Which can also form jets

Don't side step the question, I know they form jets, but there's no black hole and you said we can't have jets without black holes so explain.

Lol. No they are not!

Well that's what I get for assuming, I thought the Eagle Nebula was considered a planetary nebulae. Looks like I need to read the paper instead of skim.

Dec 14, 2018
Don't side step the question, I know they form jets, but there's no black hole and you said we can't have jets without black holes so explain.


I was talking about AGNs. Read the literature. They are too luminous to be caused by a neutron star.
And planetary nebulae have nothing to do with planets. They are ageing stars that blow off envelopes of gas. Areas where planets are forming around stars are known as protoplanetary disks.


Dec 14, 2018
I was talking about AGNs. Read the literature. They are too luminous to be caused by a neutron star.

Duh, but how do neutron stars create jets? You said without black holes we can't have jets, yet we clearly observe jets outside of AGNs.

Dec 14, 2018
I was talking about AGNs. Read the literature. They are too luminous to be caused by a neutron star.

Duh, but how do neutron stars create jets? You said without black holes we can't have jets, yet we clearly observe jets outside of AGNs.


No, read what I wrote. I was referring to AGNs. They are at galactic centres, where we see SMBHs. I know other objects cause jets, including stars, such as T Tauri stars. They are not going to be the cause of the jets in an AGN. Just go and read the literature if you want to know about astrophysical jets.

Dec 14, 2018
No, read what I wrote. I was referring to AGNs

You just can't admit you made a dumb statement. I'll answer it for you.

Black holes are not a prerequisite for astrophysical jets, intense magnetic fields are. That's why we see them from a planetary scale all the way to AGN.

Dec 14, 2018
No, read what I wrote. I was referring to AGNs

You just can't admit you made a dumb statement. I'll answer it for you.

Black holes are not a prerequisite for astrophysical jets, intense magnetic fields are. That's why we see them from a planetary scale all the way to AGN.


I didn't make a dumb statement you fuckwit. I even linked to a paper entitled "SOURCES OF RELATIVISTIC JETS IN THE GALAXY", before you started posting your idiocy. Go read it.

Dec 14, 2018
Go read it

I'm working through it, some of my favorite parts:

"Recently, several groups (Spruit, Foglizzo, & Stehle 1997; Lucek & Bell 1997; Begelman 1998) have pointed out that the toroidal field traditionally held responsible for collimating jets in the MHD mechanism is unstable and cannot collimate the jets effectively. It has been proposed alternatively that the collimating agent is the poloidal component of the magnetic field."

and

"Clearly, the time seems to be ripe for new theoretical advances on the models of formation of relativistic jets that take into account the observational features found in stellar jets."

Dec 14, 2018
Go read it

I'm working through it, some of my favorite parts:

"Recently, several groups (Spruit, Foglizzo, & Stehle 1997; Lucek & Bell 1997; Begelman 1998) have pointed out that the toroidal field traditionally held responsible for collimating jets in the MHD mechanism is unstable and cannot collimate the jets effectively. It has been proposed alternatively that the collimating agent is the poloidal component of the magnetic field."

and

"Clearly, the time seems to be ripe for new theoretical advances on the models of formation of relativistic jets that take into account the observational features found in stellar jets."


And none of this will have anything to do with the idiotic suggestion of plasmoids, which I was replying to.

Dec 14, 2018
And none of this will have anything to do with the idiotic suggestion of plasmoids, which I was replying to

I don't care what you were replying to, I asked a separate question which you didn't want to answer. MSS in a nutshell.

Dec 14, 2018
And none of this will have anything to do with the idiotic suggestion of plasmoids, which I was replying to

I don't care what you were replying to, I asked a separate question which you didn't want to answer. MSS in a nutshell.


No it isn't. You are talking sh1t. I'd already linked to a paper listing stellar black holes and neutron stars as producers of jets. If you'd read it, instead of poking your beak in, you wouldn't have needed to ask the question. They are simply not on the scale seen in AGNs, so are not candidates.
Now, have you actually got something useful to add, or are you going to carry on talking sh!t?

Dec 14, 2018
They are simply not on the scale seen in AGNs, so are not candidates.

I'm not talking scale, you are. Astrophysical jets, at any scale, are a phenomenon that are not due to gravity, and you can't admit it

Dec 14, 2018
just a qustion could these entangled particles be used for networking the trick would be to capture one as it traveled from earth towards mars then to integrate it into a micro chip say like a RAM memory chip monitor the state of the chip to receive data modify the the data on the chip to send data now your only limited by the speed of the chip as well as the amount of particles you can capture and match up on both ends in theory you could send one of these chips on a unmanned interstellar trip and get info from near by stars 20-50 years later

Dec 14, 2018
They are simply not on the scale seen in AGNs, so are not candidates.

I'm not talking scale, you are. Astrophysical jets, at any scale, are a phenomenon that are not due to gravity, and you can't admit it


What do you mean I can't admit it? I linked to a paper before you stuck your nose that outlines where jets are formed. Read it you twat. You also said planets had jets. Where did you get that from?

Dec 14, 2018
jonesdumb replied by posting a paper written by a bunch of plasma ignoramuses using maths gymnastics trying to explain how relativistic jets are formed by an infinite gravity monster. LOL!
Facts are facts, your maths gymnastics are unfalsifiable, untestable, physics defying claptrap whereas plasmoids are known and observed to create jets and are also known to form in the very conditions present at the galactic core and along these types or current systems. We can rely on real science of plasma physics or jonesdumb's physics defying faerie tales.

Dec 14, 2018
where jets are formed

Good boy, you know WHERE they are. Now HOW are they formed?

Dec 14, 2018
jonesdumb replied by posting a paper written by a bunch of plasma ignoramuses using maths gymnastics trying to explain how relativistic jets are formed by an infinite gravity monster. LOL!
Facts are facts, your maths gymnastics are unfalsifiable, untestable, physics defying claptrap whereas plasmoids are known and observed to create jets and are also known to form in the very conditions present at the galactic core and along these types or current systems. We can rely on real science of plasma physics or jonesdumb's physics defying faerie tales.


Piss off you ignorant twat. You know shit about plasma physics, and neither do any of your Velikovskian cultists. Watching planets orbit Sgr A* says they exist. You lost. And it isn't my claims, you fuckwit, it is the claims of real physicists, plasma and otherwise. You have nothing in comparison, other than deluded tosspots like Thornhill.

Dec 14, 2018
where jets are formed

Good boy, you know WHERE they are. Now HOW are they formed?


Go read the literature you tosser. What am I? Your fucking teacher? Go to school.

Dec 14, 2018
Watching **stars** orbit Sgr A* says they exist.


FTF myself.

Dec 14, 2018
I already told you how they work, but I'll elaborate a bit. There's an intense poloidal magnetic field created by active bodies, and the jets eject from the center of magnetic field where the field lines meet. With active planets and stars the dynamo theory "can" explain the magnetic fields. Black holes don't have this option, and the MHD explanation is insufficient.

So one question, if you don't answer this part with a yes or no then our discussion is over. Do you accept that astrophysical jets are powered by EM forces?

Dec 14, 2018
With active planets and stars the dynamo theory "can" explain the magnetic fields. Black holes don't have this option, and the MHD explanation is insufficient.


Why are you still talking about planets? Where are planets forming jets? And of course EM is involved, but so is gravity. Notice how all these jets are around massive objects? Binary neutron stars, via their gravity, pulling material from a companion, which is collimated into a jet through EM forces. A stellar mass BH doing the same to a companion. An SMBH pulling in matter from an accretion disc via gravity. It is not an either or situation. Something has to happen for those magnetic fields to end up the way they do.
However, this is nothing new, and can easily be found in the scientific literature. I'm really failing to see your point. Assuming you have one. Like I said - read the literature.


Dec 14, 2018
Gravity emanates from its centre of mass

The most powerful force in the universe
on the quantum scale on a single electron is the weakest force in the universe
its Achilles heel
at its centre of mass it is zero
this humble fact
that at the heart of every proton and its scrumptious electron, gravity is zero
gravity emanates from every particle in the universe
from a zero point, zero gravitational field
as
gravity is zero at the centre of mass
of every
proton
electron
planet
star
pulsar star
and finaly
zero at every BHs singularity of heart
which is why away from planets and stars
electricity and magnetism
is the strongest force in the universe
as there is only one, as magnetism ceases to exist without electricity in motion
electriciy creates
light
electromagnetic radiation
the electrons electric field
its magnetic field
their orbital's
keeping protons apart
making
Electricity the most powerful force in the universe

Dec 14, 2018
Granville, you are an uneducated twat. Have I told you that before? If not, consider it done. The total gravity of an object, based on its mass, affects objects around it. Not what is happening at its centre. You tosser. Go away, and find a sheep for the night, you retard.

Dec 14, 2018
This is very cool! Thermal fluctuations in the neutral plasma jet trigger a kink instability in the jet column with axial currents giving a weaker residual temporary "pulse gun" accelerator current along the jet column; that is the "pulses" in the illustration.

That said, the I-don't-know-electricity-but-I-like-it parade is out in full force. Since one responder has done an admirable job in providing the science - which of course the I-don't-know-electricity-and-I-don't like-to-learn brigade rejected for their own reasons - I will just sum up the trivial:

- Cosmic jets are caused by AGNs, so likely SMBHs; lesser astronomical jets by lower mass neutron star pulsars; all driven by gravity obviously.
- This has little to nothing to do with planets or their formation.
- Note that the ambiplasma is globally uncharged, so no stable currents; well tested here by rare but powerful localized current pulses causing jet energies. RTF Manual ... err, paper

Gravity 1, "EU" 0.

Dec 14, 2018
JD and his sheep
jonesdave> Granville, you are an uneducated twat. Have I told you that before? If not, consider it done. The total gravity of an object, based on its mass, affects objects around it. Not what is happening at its centre. You tosser. Go away, and find a sheep for the night, you retard.

You forgot the variation on this point only a few weeks ago
not only are you obsessed with the woolly sheep you're not paying attention
as you're not reading through properly
then you would nor have strained those greying cells
I didn't say what I appeared to say
you blurted out with what you thought I said
without considering what I actually said
It's time to tend your flock JD
out on Gargrave moors its bitter out
Your sheep need bringing into shelter JD

Dec 14, 2018
Bah, hit four when I meant five. Sorry @torbjorn.

@chicago:
just a qustion could these entangled particles
If you're talking about quantum entanglement (and it appears you are), that's not what's happening here. This is an electromagnetic field effect that's caused by magnetic lines of force being tangled along the rotation axis by the source of the magnetism spinning. Magnetism is also limited by the speed of light so this effect is inevitable.


Dec 14, 2018
JD in his aging diminishing powers

Who else could be thinking of sheep except JD
nobody but JD can see all these sheep
JDs obsessed with sheep
Every waking moment JD thinks only of sheep
sheep at breakfast lunch and tea
then finaly
after that last night sheep totty
when his head finaly touch;s the pillow
of lamb's wool
he counts sheep
so he dreams sheep in his land of nod
because
JD lives, breathes and thinks only of sheep
Baaa, baaa, baaa JD in his little world of sheep

Dec 14, 2018
Thanks JD
A sheep's eye view

A Sheppard and his sheep
Even as you're greying cells age and diminish
those aged joints creek and grown
those starry stars that once were sharp crisp and clear
on these moonlit frosty nights
those stars are not as clear as once were
those aging eyes no longer see clear
those cell of intellect not longer a clear head keep
as all that was precise and to the point
no longer is so as your vision is as misty as those desolate Gargrave moors
your thinking is so like your sheep
as vacant and wooly as you gaze into those deep blank eyes
just like the sheep you have become
so sad
Baaa, baaa, baaa JD in your little wooly world of sheep

Dec 14, 2018
Oh granny. Every time I see postings by you. scrooloose, cantthink, rusty yorkie, fredjeebusmissed, flttire pillock. segue, noreality to check, ottogimli, bennithestooge & all the other woo huckster sockpuppets bleating & baaing?
You all remind me of a flock of sheep. Specifically a pen of wethers!

Dec 15, 2018
@rrwilliejoe
With all the big science discussion here wrt the presence of electric currents, jets from a mythical SMBH etc. by CD85, jones, granville and a few others who all have some relevant material to offer/talk about - your silly-arsed comment above is all you could come up with? I see that you had trouble finding a worthy topic to add, so you plagiarised granville's reference to sheep - directly from the source. LOL Couldn't wait for another forum - you did it right in this one, aye?
Do you have to work hard at being a dumdum - or does it come natural to you?

Dec 15, 2018
@rrwillsj, you are giving this troll power by responding to it. Leave it alone. Do not respond to it, do not vote on it. It is insane and thinks reptiles are taking over the government by telepathy along with its weird Young Earth Creationism delusions. Let the doctors deal with it. No one can convince the insane.

Dec 15, 2018
Granvile... The total gravity of an object, based on its mass, affects objects around it. Not what is happening at its centre. You tosser....
says jonesybonesy

Your reading comprehension skills are wanting - perhaps the onset of senility.
Individual Objects/Mass have no "total gravity". The force of gravity ACTS upon Mass only when other objects are at some proximity to it. The closer they are to each other, the stronger the gravitational pull. The gravity at the centre of any Mass is zero and granville said nothing about what is "happening" at the centre of that Mass, only that gravity is zero in the centre -
"as
gravity is zero at the centre of mass
of every
proton
electron
planet
star
pulsar star
and finaly
zero at every BHs singularity of heart
which is why away from planets and stars
electricity and magnetism
is the strongest force in the universe"

Try concentrating on what granville said that I copied here

Dec 15, 2018
@rrwillsj, you are giving this troll power by responding to it. Leave it alone. Do not respond to it, do not vote on it. It is insane and thinks reptiles are taking over the government by telepathy along with its weird Young Earth Creationism delusions. Let the doctors deal with it. No one can convince the insane.
says Da S

LOL
Da Sicko is still talking about "young earth creationism" when everyone KNOWS already that the Earth is over 4 BILLION YEARS OLD. That hardly qualifies as a young Earth - and telepathic reptiles??? ROFLOL
WHY does the mental institution where such as Da Schniebo is obviously a patient - allow him to get onto the internet to babble crazy nonsense and accuse innocent commenters of this and that?
Hmmmm and hmm - could allowing Da Schniebo to talk on the internet be some form of mental therapy - thinking that it will cure him to spill out his craziness on the web???
I have detected/sensed a strong smell of desperation from Da Schniepo's posts.

Dec 15, 2018
Sorry, I don't troll insane people who think giant lizards are taking over the world with telepathy. I see no point.

Go cover your windows with aluminum foil or whatever.

Dec 15, 2018
In case anyone thinks this is trolling or hyperbole:

-If you talk to aliens telepathically then ...THEY ARE TELEPATHS


Here: https://phys.org/...ins.html

Dec 15, 2018
If you want to know more: https://www.thegu...undy-jfk

Dec 15, 2018
So THAT is where you get all those trash ideas you keep trying to pin on us, that stuff is toxic dude, and has no bearing on the experiences some of us have actually had.

Go wallow in your digested sci-pop-trash that is worse than The Enquirer, but do NOT go laying it on us when ALL you are doing is using it as an insult to us and to the intelligence of everyone else on the site.

I USED to think you were part way reasonable Schneib, but obviously it just is not so. When you go blaming people for YOUR thinking they are in some hellish stupid cult because they used a phrase similar to one of the thousand religious monkeys on typewriters, so Schneib thinks it is a link from SEU to this utter BS and thus he tries to use guilt by association, when all he does is show that HE reads the stupid crap himself when anyone else sees it, smiles sadly and moves along. Probably shared salacious points with jd too I would imagine.

Sounds like Papal Inquisitors with no surprise & less wit.

Dec 15, 2018
Also looks like one of them right wing like faked up media site by the Russians too, APR 26 '16.

Da Schneib, I really had thought you smarter than to even poke that rosy red snotlocker into such trash pits. I stay far, far away fro the junk, having heard too many idiots like you expound on it trying to debunk stuff that is not part of the aforementioned junk, at least not the Mockingird Version of trying to make perfectly valid facts look stupid by false attribution.

Sticking yer nose into these places for your Govt pay, or what? Making sure that certain protected techs are steered well away from by making the proponents of the REAL Science behind the cutting edge look stupid. Sorry, Electromagnetism, steadystate universe, and much stronger electromagnetism to gravity ratios showing up in the simulations turning out to work Best Fit Ever, so far. And more articles in the public proving it further.

Look for Electro-Gravitics and Magneto-gravitics in the future via Occam' razor

Dec 15, 2018
Also looks like one of them right wing like faked up media site by the Russians too, APR 26 '16.


No dummy, it is a respectable left of centre British broadsheet newspaper.

Dec 15, 2018
Gravity in centre of mass

JDs aging powers
A single atom emits a graviton
gravitons in billions emitted in single atom
attracts all atoms
a planets outermost atoms attract inner most atoms towards outermost atoms
graph of force in relation to radius
plots decreasing force towards centre of mass
decreasing gravitational force in zero at centre of mass
of forces in gravitons accelerative force
inertial weightless gravitational acceleration
in galactic centres
stars are atoms equivalent
outermost stars attract inner most stars
gravity decreases to zero from the outer most stars to zero at the galactic BH
nullifying the BHs light radius
as
JD sees those years slip by
each glorious sunset as though it is the last
JD wakes each morn to yet one more dawn chorus
As JD draws the curtains
Lets the sunrise ray illuminate the walls
As the birdsong fills the room with sound
each day taken as it comes
JD utters those immortal words
One more day as tomorrow never comes

Dec 15, 2018
^^^^^^ Clueless tosser.

Dec 15, 2018
@rrwillsj.
Oh granny. Every time I see postings by you......noreality to check, ottogimli, bennithestooge & all the other woo huckster sockpuppets bleating & baaing?
Hey willie, sounds like you didn't read the above article; else you wouldn't have included me in your 'list'. Please read the above article, willie, especially the second paragraphs:
At the core of these active galaxies, supermassive black holes launch high-speed jets of plasma—a hot, ionized gas—that shoot millions of light years into space. This process may be the source of cosmic rays with energies tens of millions of times higher than the energy unleashed in the most powerful manmade particle accelerator.
Note the last sentence, willie; it confirms what I have been pointing out to Phys-1, RNP et al for years. I reminded of same in my post on Dec 13 above.

In future, willie, please take the trouble to read and understand properly in context so that you won't (rightly) end up on your own 'list'. :)

Dec 15, 2018
Frankly & Ernestly.
To me?
All you cultist woomongering sheep, look alike, sound alike and smell alike!

Dec 15, 2018
@rrwillsj.
Frankly & Ernestly.
To me?
All you cultist woomongering sheep, look alike, sound alike and smell alike!
Take a moment to consider how you 'look, sound and smell' like when you don't take note of all the facts before making 'lists' on which you YOURSELF may qualify for INCLUSION because you didn't read and understand properly in context BEFORE making posts that 'look, sound and smell' like TROLLING. Do/Be better in future, willie; for science and humanity's sake. :)

Dec 15, 2018
Note the last sentence, willie; it confirms what I have been pointing out to Phys-1, RNP et al for years. I reminded of same in my post on Dec 13 above.

In future, willie, please take the trouble to read and understand properly in context so that you won't (rightly) end up on your own 'list'. :)


Oh do f*** off! Ignorant idiot. You are not even close to understanding what is going on, you poser!

Dec 15, 2018
@jonesdave.
Note the last sentence, willie; it confirms what I have been pointing out to Phys-1, RNP et al for years. I reminded of same in my post on Dec 13 above.

In future, willie, please take the trouble to read and understand properly in context so that you won't (rightly) end up on your own 'list'. :)
Oh do f*** off! Ignorant idiot. You are not even close to understanding what is going on, you poser!
Don't you even STOP and THINK anymore BEFORE making your usual trolling insults, jonesy? Not good, mate. :)

Jonesy, mate, I was attacked/trolled/insulted, for years now, for pointing out to RNP etc EXACTLY what the above mainstream article NOW ALSO points out...
This process may be the source of cosmic rays with energies tens of millions of times higher than the energy unleashed in the most powerful manmade particle accelerator.
...and YOU STILL have the TROLL STUPIDITY and/or BIAS and/or DISHONESTY to call ME "ignorant idiot"? Jonesy, mate, R U OK?

Dec 15, 2018
Associating someone with what they said is obvious. Trying to deny what was said when it's there in black and white is ludicrous, and insane. If you don't mean it don't say it. If you're quoting someone, put it in quotes and source it. These are simple things.

Dec 15, 2018
BTW, does anyone have anything that's well-sourced and verifiable in the scholarly literature about this article?

You know, just askin' and stuf.

Dec 16, 2018
@Da Schneib.
Associating someone with what they said is obvious.
True. But you forget to mention that you and others have been shown to be guilty of misattributing stuff to me things that were your own strawmen/miscontruings.
Trying to deny what was said when it's there in black and white is ludicrous, and insane.
Also true. So why do you, jonesy etc STILL DO THAT? For years, I pointed out what is NOW being confirmed by mainstream articles like the above; yet YOU/your 'mates', DS, were trolling/insulting me for doing so! Here are just two links; to threads where you/gang were DENYING and INSULTING from your own malice/bias/ignorance, and REFUSING to read/understand properly in context; despite ME being correct on the known/evolving science all along:

https://phys.org/...ies.html
https://phys.org/...ies.html

So, will you, DS, and jonesy, RNP etc STOP DOING THAT now? :)

Dec 16, 2018
What's the matter @105LiarRC, your own tactics used against you starting to make you butthurt?

Stop using those tactics. Maybe we'll notice eventually, like after the same number of years you've been deploying them. Maybe you shouldn't have opened the box if you didn't like what's inside.

Of course you'd have to admit you're not the smartest man in the world for that. I doubt you can.

You seem to be desperately pulling open sections of the backpack and screaming in terror when clothes come out instead of a parachute.

Dec 16, 2018
@Da Schneib.
What's the matter @105LiarRC, your own tactics used against you starting to make you butthurt?

Stop using those tactics. Maybe we'll notice eventually, like after the same number of years you've been deploying them. Maybe you shouldn't have opened the box if you didn't like what's inside.

Of course you'd have to admit you're not the smartest man in the world for that. I doubt you can.

You seem to be desperately pulling open sections of the backpack and screaming in terror when clothes come out instead of a parachute.
You're in denial, DS. And, in your own words:
Trying to deny what was said when it's there in black and white is ludicrous, and insane.
AS for 'tactics', DS; my 'tactic' has been to point out known/evolving science. Whereas you, DS and 'gang', just bot-voted, trolled and insulted employing the patently ANTI-science/discourse 'tactics' which you/gang invented/promulgated here and elsewhere, as per examples I linked to above. Denial.

Dec 16, 2018
@105LiarRC, your tactics have been to twist the words of what you do not want to admit.

Now, can we talk about the particle acceleration in cosmic jets? Or are you still trying to avoid the science by bringing up your weird politics?

And don't bother telling us you were "always right." You were always a nutjob and the posting history proves it. 105 thread on which you iied and got caught. Want me to start posting them again?

Dec 16, 2018
@jonesdave.

I'm amused to see your recent whining about _S_E_U taking your comments out of context and trolling you based on that out-of-context 'attribution'. I am amused because, when DS did that to me, you were admiring of such dastardly tactics and couldn't care less, and even went so far as to blame me for trying to defend against same. Well, mate, THAT 'chicken' has come home to roost....so you now reap what you have sown by up-voting '5' to such tactics when used by DS and the rest of your mates. Can you now see your serious error of judgement in so long SUPPORTING such tactics against ME, jd?

I also am amused by your exasperated whining when @granville mocks you, jd.; because for years you supported/encouraged such mocking when @Uncle Ira was mocking me. So THAT 'chicken' too has come home to roost for you, jd.

As I reminded more than once:
What goes around, comes around.
So isn't it about time you stopped whining hypocritically and just Do/Be better, jd? :)

Dec 16, 2018
It doesn't matter how often you try to distract from the science, @105LiarRC. Everyone still sees you're doing it.

Particle acceleration in cosmic jets is completely absent from your post, which means your agenda is to disrupt, not to talk about the science.

Dec 16, 2018
@Da Schneib.
@105LiarRC, your tactics have been to twist the words of what you do not want to admit.
Says the master at doing that to ME. Have you n o shame, DS? In your own words:
Trying to deny what was said when it's there in black and white is ludicrous, and insane.
Yet it has been YOU all along doing that 'insane' thing while I have been correct all along on the known/evolving science pointed out as you/gang trolled etc. Your own words damn you, DS; so don't dig any deeper by trying to deny and twist your way out of your recorded failings now.
Now, can we talk about the particle acceleration in cosmic jets?
You're obviously NOT READING again, DS. Read, DS. I BEGAN "talking about" THAT topic in my first post above; and ALSO REMINDED of my LONGSTANDING "talking about" same.
And don't bother telling us you were "always right."
After years of trolling/insults/ignorance/malice from YOU/gang, DS, it is proper to point it out for the intelligent readers. :)

Dec 16, 2018
@Da Schneib.
It doesn't matter how often you try to distract from the science, @105LiarRC. Everyone still sees you're doing it.

Particle acceleration in cosmic jets is completely absent from your post, which means your agenda is to disrupt, not to talk about the science.
You're still NOT READING, DS. My FIRST post above was "talking about" such; and I reminded of how long (for years) I have been 'talking about' such. That you pretend to deny it all and come back with lame diversions like that tells the intelligent readers all they need to know who it has been that has "talked out" the PERSON while attacking from their own ignorance and malice, not to mention hypocrisy and just lame insensibility like you are showing again now, DS. Stop digging, DS.

DS, if you were really interested in the subject matter of the article, then you would have addressed what I said in my very first post and posts over years now to you and the 'gang', instead of trolling, denying etc.

Dec 16, 2018
@idiot lying POS sam fodera the fraudulent criminal pseudoscience crackpot TROLL
despite ME being correct on the known/evolving science all along
no evidence at all, whatsoever, of this claim

reported for pseudoscience and lying

when you make a vague claim that [x] isn't correct, then making a definitive statement like
at least 4 fatal flaws jump out
while then refusing to actually provide those 4 fatal flaws (and 4 other flaws per your claims) while then making the statement
As you know I am too busy to start new conversations
followed by 8,357 posts where you still can't actually prove you pointed to any flaws is considered fraud and blatant baiting/trolling

I'm just going to report all your posts in this thread for baiting

feel free to continue to post while I report those too (unless you specifically call out all 8 flaws or link to a conversation where they exist)

TOCD bullsh*t rant in 3...
2...
1...

Dec 16, 2018
@Forum.

And there you have it again, folks, from the ass's own mouth. Lying, ignoring, denying and trolling; and trying to 'rewrite history' according to his now-infamous 'CS-TL;DR Research Method'; which willfully ignored and/or conveniently missed all the facts that would prove CS is lying not only to himself but to you all as well. Sad.

Dec 16, 2018
Still waiting for something on magnetic fields, particles, or SMBH in AGNs.

Dec 17, 2018
@Da Schneib.
Still waiting for something on magnetic fields, particles, or SMBH in AGNs.
Tell that to your mate, CS. He just trolled his usual 'noises' again. I already did my bit re the on-science subject matter in my very first post in this thread (and in all the years of posts pointing out exactly what the above article now also confirms). Perhaps you can ask CS to make his comments re the on-science subject matter of the article as well, instead of just trolling again? That would be good. :)

Dec 17, 2018
And still waiting for something on magnetic fields, particles, or SMBH in AGNs. Your first post on this thread was about how you were right again.

Dec 17, 2018
@Da Schneib.
And still waiting for something on magnetic fields, particles, or SMBH in AGNs.
You still haven't asked your mate, CS, for such. Why?
Your first post on this thread was about how you were right again.
You're NOT READING, DS. FIRST I said:
For years I've pointed out (to Phys-1, RNP etc) that these accretion-disc-polar-jet systems create orders-of-magnitude MORE powerful 'accelerators' than manmade LHC etc; and that material being entrained/deconstructed/ejected as Quark-Gluon plasma which then REFORMS into 'pristine-looking' hydrgen/helium; which is why ALL BB-related interpretations are SUSPECT/MISLEADING; because 'pristine/primordial-looking' stuff is ALWAYS BEING REFORMED from RECYCLED energy-matter via 'systems' like these; hence making all BB-based 'calculations/expectations (ie, "BB-nucleosynthesis estimates" etc etc) INVALID and MISLEADING.
Effectively AGREEING with article. THEN I recalled being attacked while being correct all along. :)

Dec 17, 2018
For years I've pointed out
We done here?

Dec 17, 2018
@Da Schneib.
For years I've pointed out
We done here?
LoL. Just recently @jonesdave complained about S_E_U taking HIS comment out of context...and I made a post to jonesy pointing out how he had been OK with that sort of thing while YOU, DS, were doing it to ME for years. And what do YOU do NOW, DS?....you AGAIN have the insensibility to take those few opening words out of the FULL CONTEXT of the larger paragraph! How silly can you get, DS?... you just AGAIN proved my point made to @jonesdave only a few hours ago. Didn't you READ that post either, DS? Apparently NOT...else you might have had the sense NOT to try it again here. Truly, DS, you not only never read in context, you also never learn from your (by now innumerable) faux pas. Wise up and stop trolling like a twit, DS. Be genuine science discourser, not a dishonest stupid ego-maniac ego-tripping insensible troll projecting your failings onto one who has been correct all along while you incorrect. LEARN.

Dec 17, 2018
A Spiral Galaxy in current carrying conduction

A flattend disc
a rotational disc
of dust
of stars
of plasma
plasma and stars are the same
electrons in galactic rotation
as galactic rotation is a current
a current encircled by perpendicular circular magnetic fields
effectively a solenoid
this galaxy is one ginormous continuous circular currant carrying conductor encircled by its magnetic field
with its magnetic centrally spin-axis jets

A project for the Three Billy goat Trollians this coming Christmas eve
TRC, TDS and TJD
Given the rotational velocity of this galaxy
the plasmatic ions in circular rotation
what is the current
what is the magnetic field
what is this fields Tesla
as this is driving this central magnetic jet
a complete assessment and magnitude of magnetic field strength
Will earn Trollian RealityCheck (TRC)
A closer date to your entitlement of your true title TRC as that includes TDS and TJD
Good look

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