Surface melting causes Antarctic glaciers to slip faster towards the ocean, new research shows

Surface melting causes Antarctic glaciers to slip faster towards the ocean, new research shows
Drygalski Glacier, Antarctic Peninsula. Credit: Google Earth

Surface meltwater draining through the ice and beneath Antarctic glaciers is causing sudden and rapid accelerations in their flow towards the sea, according to new research.

This is the first time scientists have found that melting on the surface impacts the flow of in Antarctica.

Using imagery and data from satellites alongside regional climate modeling, scientists at the University of Sheffield have found that is causing some glaciers to move at speeds 100 percent faster than average (up to 400m per year) for a period of several days multiple times per year.

Glaciers move downhill due to gravity via the internal deformation of ice, and basal sliding—where they slide over the ground beneath them, lubricated by liquid water.

The new research, published today in Nature Communications, shows that accelerations in Antarctic Peninsula glaciers' movements coincide with spikes in snowmelt. This association occurs because surface meltwater penetrates to the ice bed and lubricates glacier flow.

The scientists expect that as temperatures continue to rise in the Antarctic, surface melting will occur more frequently and across a wider area, making it an important factor in determining the speed at which glaciers move towards the sea.

Ultimately, they predict that glaciers on the Antarctic Peninsula will behave like those in present-day Greenland and Alaska, where meltwater controls the size and timing of variations in glacier flow across seasons and years.

The effects of such a major shift in Antarctic glacier melt on ice flow has not yet been incorporated into the models used to predict the future mass balance of the Antarctic Ice Sheet and its contribution to sea level rise.

Dr. Jeremy Ely, Independent Research Fellow at the University of Sheffield's Department of Geography and author of the study, said: "Our research shows for the first time that surface meltwater is getting beneath glaciers in the Antarctic Peninsula—causing short bursts of sliding towards the sea 100 percent faster than normal.

"As atmospheric temperatures continue to rise, we expect to see more surface meltwater than ever, so such behaviour may become more common in Antarctica.

"It's crucial that this factor is considered in models of future sea level rise, so we can prepare for a world with fewer and smaller glaciers."

Pete Tuckett, who made the discovery while studying for his Masters in Polar and Alpine Change at the University of Sheffield, said: "The direct link between surface melting and glacier flow rates has been well documented in other regions of the world, but this is the first time we have seen this coupling anywhere in Antarctica.

"Given that atmospheric temperatures, and hence surface melt rates, in Antarctica are predicted to increase, this discovery could have significant implications for future rates of ."


Explore further

Ice loss accelerating in Greenland's coastal glaciers, study finds

More information: Peter A. Tuckett et al. Rapid accelerations of Antarctic Peninsula outlet glaciers driven by surface melt, Nature Communications (2019). DOI: 10.1038/s41467-019-12039-2
Journal information: Nature Communications

Citation: Surface melting causes Antarctic glaciers to slip faster towards the ocean, new research shows (2019, September 20) retrieved 17 October 2019 from https://phys.org/news/2019-09-surface-antarctic-glaciers-faster-ocean.html
This document is subject to copyright. Apart from any fair dealing for the purpose of private study or research, no part may be reproduced without the written permission. The content is provided for information purposes only.
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Sep 20, 2019
Has Antarctica been ice free before? Yes.

It's within normal bounds for Antarctica to be ice free. You may relax now.

Sep 20, 2019
Yes, it was only 34 million years ago that Antarctica was last ice-free. Of course it wasn't located at the South Pole then, either.

Sep 20, 2019
I find it unlikely that mankind will get its collective hinnies in gear before we see 2.5 or 3-degree centigrade warming on a global average.

I suspect we are getting quite close to the point where massive permafrost melt will dump an enormous amount of methane into the atmosphere. While its residency time is on the order of 10 years, that burst of heating will cause most of the remaining polar ice to be lost resulting in a drastic decrease in polar albedo will cause additional destabilization of deep ocean methane clathrates and another huge burst in methane releases.

By the time we see the methane from those releases get sufficiently degraded, all of this additional warming will force greenland and antartica ice losses from the land areas.

We will be very lucky if we limit warming to 3 degrees by 2100. And the effects on the planet will be catestrophic.

Sep 20, 2019
I suspect we are getting quite close to the point where massive permafrost melt will dump an enormous amount of methane into the atmosphere.

And, i know you are stupid, because you know...facts. But, suspect away, idiot.

ALASKA SHOWS NO SIGNS OF RISING ARCTIC METHANE
https://phys.org/...ane.html

Sep 20, 2019
ALASKA SHOWS NO SIGNS OF RISING ARCTIC METHANE
https://phys.org/...ane.html

Dated 2014
Date:
April 15, 2019
Source:
Harvard University
Summary:
A recent study shows that nitrous oxide emissions from thawing Alaskan permafrost are about twelve times higher than previously assumed. About one fourth of the Northern Hemisphere is covered in permafrost, which is thawing at an increasing rate. As temperatures increase, the peat releases more and more greenhouse gases. And, even though researchers are monitoring carbon dioxide and methane, no one seems to be watching the most potent greenhouse gas: nitrous oxide.

Sep 20, 2019
"Given that atmospheric temperatures, and hence surface melt rates, in Antarctica are predicted to increase, this discovery could have significant implications for future rates of sea level rise."


Complete Alarmist crap. This is disgraceful publishing.

Sep 20, 2019
Wow. The stupid is strong in the mtnphot Chicken Little idiot.
Since that 2014 report, they haven't found any increase in CO2 nor methane, which according to AGW Cult "science" must be increasing. Now, the amount of nitrous oxide in the permafrost pales in comparison to CO2 and methane, and if these aren't increasing, then, is the nitrous oxide increasing?

Sep 20, 2019
@antigoracle.
Since that 2014 report, they haven't found any increase in CO2 nor methane, which according to AGW Cult "science" must be increasing. Now, the amount of nitrous oxide in the permafrost pales in comparison to CO2 and methane, and if these aren't increasing, then, is the nitrous oxide increasing?
Only 'weaponised stupids' and/or 'bots' employed/programmed by the Russian/Fossil/GOP troll-factory could be so insensible as to not realise the increasing population and increasing burning of fossil fuels is producing increased emissions of all sorts of greenhouse gases, including CO2. They are, by their very design/programming, incapable of figuring out where those additional emissions are going, and what effects those increased emissions are having apart from the observed warming. Pity the weaponised stupids' and 'bots'...for they know not what they say or do. Sad.

Sep 20, 2019
Only a low-end 'weaponised stupid' and/or 'bot' employed/programmed by the Russian/Fossil/GOP troll-factory could be so insensible as to not realise the increasing population and increasing burning of fossil fuels is producing increased emissions of all sorts of greenhouse gases, including CO2. It is incapable of figuring out where those additional emissions are going and hat effects they are having apart from the observed warming. Pity the weaponised stupids' and 'bots'...for they know not what they say or do. Sad.


FACT: Things are better than ever before in human history.

You are a delusional ignoramus.


Sep 20, 2019
@Old_C_Code.
Only a low-end 'weaponised stupid' and/or 'bot' employed/programmed by the Russian/Fossil/GOP troll-factory could be so insensible as to not realise the increasing population and increasing burning of fossil fuels is producing increased emissions of all sorts of greenhouse gases, including CO2. It is incapable of figuring out where those additional emissions are going and hat effects they are having apart from the observed warming. Pity the weaponised stupids' and 'bots'...for they know not what they say or do. Sad.
FACT: Things are better than ever before in human history. You are a delusional ignoramus.
At what cost, mate? Things are 'good' but getting worse now, and increasingly so, if you would but get off your silly arse and actually check the evolving reality around you. Your delusional complacency is in danger of becoming a danger not only to yourself but also to your family, friends and community/society in general, locally and globally. Wake up!

Sep 20, 2019
At what cost, mate? Things are 'good' but getting worse now, and increasingly so, if you would but get off your silly arse and actually check the evolving reality around you. Your delusional complacency is in danger of becoming a danger not only to yourself but also to your family, friends and community/society in general, locally and globally. Wake up!

Well, well, look who took their meds, which while quite potent, sorry, does not fix stupid. Thus the above.

Sep 21, 2019
A couple of glaciers double their speed a few days per year, this is the facts the article reports. Eventually this will increase the rate of sea rise but not in my lifetime.

Alaska permafrost is another animal entirely. It spent almost forty years at the phase change temperature (32 F, 0 C) and is now beginning a new rate change six times larger than the forty previous years.
More CO2 than CH4 but tremendously large amounts of both in a very short time. I assume the same for Siberia but do not live in a university town there so cannot speak to those who actually do the field research.

My local area has twenty degree warmer winters for close to twenty five years, I project that change to the tropics in just a few more years (they are getting over ten now) and I can see the refugee crisis turn into active war, like we are already seeing.

Yes, I am saying the middle east is a climate change resource war and getting larger faster.

Sep 21, 2019
Siberia had massive fires in the peat permafrost this summer. Nobody wants to talk about it much.

Alaska had a bunch this year too, and the trend is upward.

Nobody's reporting on it though.

Sep 21, 2019
Oh, and Alaska is having a drought. You might see that if you're paying attention, but nobody much is.

The Pacific Northwest had theirs 20 years ago.

Butbutbuttthere'snoglobalwarming.

Sep 21, 2019
Yes, it was only 34 million years ago that Antarctica was last ice-free. Of course it wasn't located at the South Pole then, either.


It was also 15 degrees C warmer for tens of millions of years with life everywhere too.
The fact which makes you the dumb azz in this debate equation.


Sep 21, 2019
@Old doesn't get it.

It's never been 15C warmer when there were even archaic humans. And there's billions of us now.

Nobody ever said it would kill off all life. Only us.

But I'm not worried. I got mine. I'll have enough money to make it until I die, and I'm not in any risky place. Apres moi, le deluge.

Sep 21, 2019
oldcode
FACT: Things are better than ever before in human history. You are a delusional ignoramus
In the new trumpian era - saying something enough times - makes it a fact. So - we have some serious problems in our world. Today's article is talking about glaciers - and the reality that we are watching the Earth warm - and the cascade of events coming from that warming. Scientists are pretty much in agreement - that this is a problem - and has serious implications for our species. And the denier response is "but things are better now than they ever have been" Of course it is a 5 year old response. How does "but things are better now..." in any way address the problems we are staring down? It doesn't. But repeat it enough times - and oldcode thinks he/she has actually made a fact. It is as if these deniers have a play book. Just keep turning to a different page - and read a line. Then sit back smug - and think you have actually said something meaningful.

Sep 21, 2019
In the new trumpian era - saying something enough times - makes it a fact.


See Harvard Prof Dr. Steven Pinker's work. Nothing to do with Trump you meathead.

Things are better than ever before in human history.

You're just a wanna be loser.

Sep 21, 2019
It's never been 15C warmer when there were even archaic humans.


But: butterflies, deer, and dinosaurs did well.
LOL you foolish clown.

Nobody's reporting on it though.

You freaking liar, they report on anything remotely related to climate change.

Sep 21, 2019
and oldcode thinks he/she has actually made a fact.


Things are better than ever before in human history. Dr Steven Pinker's work clearly shows it.

So what year was the best in human history genius?
Fool.

Sep 21, 2019
So what year was the best in human history genius?
I don't know oldcode. But the point we keep making back at you - is it does not matter. Just because we have great technology, and medicine, and food supply etc. etc. today - says nothing about climate change. So in relation to climate change - which is the subject of today's article - your assertion is meaningless. I'll give you an analogy. The car is heading towards the cliff. Old C says - but the A/C is working better than it ever did. So what?

Let me try a different tack. If you lived in a refugee camp in Syria (for example) - you had very little food to eat, no job, lived in a tent with no running water, and were seriously sick with dysentery - would it be relevant to say "well things have never been better?" Or would you like your fellow humans to give a damn - and try addressing the conditions causing your situation?

Sep 21, 2019
I/we found the title of the above article extremely odd, amusing and incredibly unworthy of publishing anywhere, since it is just a part of natural dynamics - nothing magical about it.
Perhaps the author of the piece, Sophie Armour is too young to remember the time before the invention of freezers as part of the refrigerator duo, when big blocks of ice were delivered by horse-drawn carts or old-time trucks/lorries to individual homes where the ice blocks were brought into kitchens and placed carefully into "ice boxes".
As the ice melted from the top of its surface, the water would fall into the bottom of the ice and cause the block of ice to slip around in its container and no longer be centred. And of course the water would have to be drained to prevent overflowing.
It is the same principle with the slippage of glaciers as the surface ice melts and gravity causes the water to fall.
It is nothing new, and it is surprising that the AGW cult seems to imagine that it is new.

Sep 21, 2019
@greenonions

Your comparing the citizens of middle-eastern countries to those of the western civilisations is quite disingenuous, since the differences between the haves in civilised western nations and the have-nots in third world nations is incomparable and assumes that the haves are somehow taking something from those who have-not 'unfairly' and denying them those things that were EARNED by the haves. That kind of thinking is the way of the Socialists who think that it is kind to share everything with those who haven't earned it or worked for it. And I am not talking about CHARITY here.
If you are a Socialist/Communist, you will be working toward preventing any free individual from owning property of their own. You will work (politically and socially) toward stealing from the haves and giving that booty to those who haven't earned and worked for it - or paid for it.
This is the visceral difference between the third world and nations like the US, UK and western Europe.
-contd-

Sep 21, 2019
Slip Sliding Away

Surface melt water
Draining through the ice
And beneath Antarctic glaciers
Is causing sudden
And rapid accelerations
In their flow towards the sea
According to new research?

This new research
Is billions of years
Out of date
Ask any polar bear
Or were they polar dino-bears
in those far of days!

Sep 21, 2019
The major differences between the third world nations and western civilised peoples are that certain LAWS OF THE LAND are in effect and MUST be obeyed. These laws prevent dictatorships and their military enforcers from coming into power, according to the will of the LEGAL citizens of each nation. And it is those LAWS that prevent the hostile takeover of the rightful ownership of property by the legal citizens.
Now, there are certain anti-personal freedom elements in the governments of the US, UK and western Europe who are working hard to eliminate those LAWS that make free nations what they are. They are embedded in the US Congress, the UK Parliament and in certain European nations.

The AGW cultist Elites are also in the Socialist camps and will require individuals to give up their freedoms and rights of self-determination for the sake of the cause for removing the precious CO2 from the atmosphere - the very same CO2 that is the food required by plants for growth.

Sep 21, 2019
Have you heard, SEU
Of the extinction rebellion
Holding the freight up, at Dover

Sep 21, 2019
Have you heard, SEU
Of the extinction rebellion
Holding the freight up, at Dover


No I haven't yet. I will look it up now, granville and thanks for the 'heads-up'.

Sep 21, 2019
Extinction rebellion or Climate change

Extinction Rebellion
abbreviated as XR
is a socio-political movement
with the stated aim
of using civil disobedience
and nonviolent resistance
to compel government action
on climate breakdown
biodiversity loss
and the risk
of social
and
Ecological collapse

https://en.wikipe...ebellion

Sep 21, 2019
Yes. I have also read the following two articles and I have to admire how the enemies of plant food (CO2) have brainwashed students, teachers, school administrators, politicians, and most of all, the parents of the students themselves into allowing the kids to have the day off to demonstrate, picket, march and learn how to stand against authority, as well as miss out on their STEM lessons in science such as the value of CO2 as plant food and which is the source of their breathable Oxygen (O2). Next, British students will be clamoring for a "safe space" in the same way that American college students have been doing. It must be catching.

https://www.breit...ictions/

https://www.teleg...weekend/


Sep 21, 2019
This Rubicon's crossed

Ah!
So now
These extinction climate change activists have boxed clever
Have boxed themselves into a corner
Fore
If you want to taken seriously
By the public at large
You have to get a high percentage of your predications correct

For the public at large
Have apparently seen through this extinction climate change activists ruse
Especially as they have included extinction activists to their cause
Including extinction activists
Is this fatal mistake
As the public at large sense this defeat
Sense this fear
That
Extinction climate change activists have over stepped this mark
They have crossed their Rubicon
Their cause died an immediate death
When
They included extinction activists in climate change activists

For SEU, climate change is dead and buried by these extinction activists!

p.s. how appropriate, climate change, dead and buried, by these extinction activists!

Sep 21, 2019
SEU
If you are a Socialist/Communist
I am neither. So please drop that line of attack- it is childish.
Your comparing the citizens of middle-eastern countries to those of the western civilisations is quite disingenuous
I was not making any such comparison. I was simply constructing an analogy - for the purpose of demonstrating a point.

However - I do think it is a very appropriate criticism of capitalism - to look at the wealth disparities that are current realities in our world- and to say that this is indicative of serious problems in terms of our system.


Sep 21, 2019
@antigoracle.
At what cost, mate? Things are 'good' but getting worse now, and increasingly so, if you would but get off your silly arse and actually check the evolving reality around you. Your delusional complacency is in danger of becoming a danger not only to yourself but also to your family, friends and community/society in general, locally and globally. Wake up!

Well, well, look who took their meds, which while quite potent, sorry, does not fix stupid. Thus the above.
Oh, look who did NOT take their meds to control/minimise their 'weaponised stupidity' symptoms? Take your meds, mate; so you can return to your 'normal' just-plain-stupid self instead of continuing in that industrial-strength-stupid state which you've been so assiduously demonstrating for the internet audience so far. Too bad. :)

Sep 21, 2019
@Old_C_Code.
But: butterflies, deer, and dinosaurs did well.
Are you seriously this obtuse, mate? Or are you starting a "bring back the Dinosaurs" movement? Why can't you get it? Life 'as we know it' NOW will be decimated; and the cockroaches, rodents and reptiles will be the only ones thanking you for your help in bringing about humanly-intolerable range/extremities of temps and weather instability/events conducive to all sorts of human-unfriendly diseases, parasites, pests, plants and animals. Get it? The LONG TRANSITION PERIOD to that 'new normal' will be what kills us off, long before the new normal settles in and the new flora and fauna that has adapted to it settles in....by which stage we humans will have been 'toast' as a global civilisation. Wake up, mate! :)

Sep 21, 2019
I don't know oldcode. But the point we keep making back at you - is it does not matter. Just because we have great technology, and medicine, and food supply etc. etc. today - says nothing about climate change.


You have less and less credibility as you claim emergencies that are just NOT emergencies.
You just don't get it. The data is not clear, most data shown removes all the 1930's warming.
You seem to NEVER see graphs that cover the entire 20th century together.

You are an Alarmist ally lying to children around the world about their future.
Tell the kids the truth; things are better than ever before in human history.
And banks still give out 30 year mortgages in Miami, and CO2 is a good life force on Earth.

Sep 21, 2019
Are you seriously this obtuse, mate? Or are you starting a "bring back the Dinosaurs" movement?


That was in reference to someone claiming the antarctic was not at the south pole 34 million years ago. But the average temperature of Earth was 15 degrees C warmer for tens of millions of years with plenty of life everywhere.

Sep 21, 2019
@Old_C_Code.
claim emergencies that are just NOT emergencies.
You just don't get it. The data is not clear, most data shown removes all the 1930's warming.
You seem to NEVER see graphs that cover the entire 20th century together.
Alarmist ally lying to children around the world about their future.
Tell the kids the truth; things are better than ever before in human history.
And banks still give out 30 year mortgages in Miami, and CO2 is a good life force on Earth.
Go tell that to all the millions affected when UNPRECEDENTED THREE 'monster' Hurricanes (Harvey, Irma, Maria) struck the US in rapid succession in 2017. And already THIS year two major hurricanes created devastation in Bahamas and on US east coast. The story is similar for the Typhoons in Asia and major storms elsewhere. They're getting UNPRECEDENTEDLY bigger, slower, more damaging and such close succession that recovery is almost impossible before the next one hits. Wake up and get with the REALITY NOW, mate. :)

Sep 21, 2019
Go tell that to all the millions affected when UNPRECEDENTED THREE 'monster' Hurricanes (Harvey, Irma, Maria) struck the US in rapid succession in 2017.


LOL, and only 2 major hurricanes for the prior 10 years.

You are totally an ALARMIST FOOL.

Sep 22, 2019
@Old_C-Code.
Go tell that to all the millions affected when UNPRECEDENTED THREE 'monster' Hurricanes (Harvey, Irma, Maria) struck the US in rapid succession in 2017.


LOL, and only 2 major hurricanes for the prior 10 years.

You are totally an ALARMIST FOOL.
Are you really so silly? The TREND is for CLUSTERS of storms and those storms being slower and more extensive/damaging and increasingly difficult if not impossible to recover from. Not to mention all the OTHER manifestations of this warming/destabilising TREND re increasingly extreme/unseasonal droughts/floods/bushfires/hailstorms etc etc etc. What does it take to get the stark view of the GLOBAL reality evolving NOW through your 'rose coloured glasses', mate? Ditch those glasses, they are lying to you. Good luck to us all.

Sep 22, 2019
Oh @RC, it's always a bummer to witness your crazy on top of your stupid. Now, be a good idiot and go take your insanity meds so that we may safely ridicule your stupidity.

Sep 22, 2019
@antigoracle.
Oh @RC, it's always a bummer to witness your crazy on top of your stupid. Now, be a good idiot and go take your insanity meds so that we may safely ridicule your stupidity.
Your insensibility and insanity has some use, @antigoracle; as your commensurably inept efforts affords opportunities for me and others to refute the usual anti-climate-science spiels you and others like you have long been paid to post on the internet. Unfortunately for you, your fellows, and your paymasters, the reality is catching up with both their destructive/miscreant business models/profits and what's left of your and your fellows' sanity....as demonstrated by your latest series of low-grade crap-trolls, which must be sorely disappointing your paymasters. Pity.

Sep 22, 2019
SEU
If you are a Socialist/Communist
I am neither. So please drop that line of attack- it is childish.
Your comparing the citizens of middle-eastern countries to those of the western civilisations is quite disingenuous
I was not making any such comparison. I was simply constructing an analogy - for the purpose of demonstrating a point.


analogy | əˈnaləjē |
noun (plural analogies)
a comparison between two things, typically for the purpose of explanation or clarification

However - I do think it is a very appropriate criticism of capitalism - to look at the wealth disparities that are current realities in our world- and to say that this is indicative of serious problems in terms of our system.
says greenonions

Perhaps you were unaware that 'comparison' and 'analogy' are synonymous in their meaning.
As to disparities of wealth in the third world, it is the dictatorships that rule those countries that must be observed and criticised.

Sep 22, 2019
@greenonions

It is 'Free Capitalism' that has provided humans in the western world the opportunities to assume levels of wealth through a good education and chances for a better future due to that Free Capitalism. This type of Capitalism not only allows wealth for honest individuals, but also for the greater part of the citizenry who are also willing to work with that system. It also makes possible the provision of Charities where individuals are free to donate funds to help others who are in need. It is an unbeatable system and is what makes the western countries so successful.
Other nations are poor due to their political structure of poverty that is engendered by their own bureaucracy and Elites. This is why millions of humans are willing to make their way to the West in order that they may find a better life.
And YOU are complaining about Capitalism?

Sep 22, 2019
@Old_C_Code.
claim emergencies that are just NOT emergencies.
You just don't get it. The data is not clear, most data shown removes all the 1930's warming.
You seem to NEVER see graphs that cover the entire 20th century together.

Tell the kids the truth; things are better than ever before....
And banks still give out 30 year mortgages in Miami, and CO2 is a good life force on Earth.
Go tell that to all the millions affected when UNPRECEDENTED THREE 'monster' Hurricanes (Harvey, Irma, Maria) struck the US in rapid succession in 2017. And already THIS year two major hurricanes created devastation in Bahamas and on US east coast. The story is similar for the Typhoons in Asia and major storms elsewhere. They're getting UNPRECEDENTEDLY bigger, slower, more damaging and such close succession that recovery is almost impossible before the next one hits. Wake up and get with the REALITY NOW, mate. :)
says RC

https://en.wikipe...urricane


Sep 22, 2019
The hurricane of 1827 happened in the era of wooden sailing ships, RC, where many of them could not withstand the force and power of its winds, and were sunk with much loss of life.
Hurricanes are a thing of Nature, RC, and there is nothing that can be done about them, expect to remain well away from coastlines as Barack Obama has chosen not to do.
In 1827 there wasn't much digging for coal and there was no digging petrol and gas fields. There was plenty of trees cut down for firewood. Firewood for heating water, cooking food and warming hands and bottoms. In those days they were still using large copper pans with long handles and covers to warm beds before getting into them. Hurricanes passed through, did their damage, and then humans got together to clean up and rebuild. They didn't complain unless someone had died due to the storm. They just did what they had to do and everyone tried to make the best of their circumstances. There was genuine fellowship in those days.

Sep 22, 2019
The Extinctionists, Extinction Activists, Hath Fallen on their sword

SEU> he hurricane of 1827 happened in the era of wooden sailing ships, RC, where many of them could not withstand the force and power of its winds, and were sunk with much loss of life.
Hurricanes are a thing of Nature, RC, and there is nothing that can be done about them.

Fore, SEU
These extinction activists
Have focused the mind
Brought the public gaze
On these extinction activists
That by blocking heavy freight haulage
Members of the public
On their way to France
By blocking road traffic at DOVER
Theses extinction activists have extinguished this climate change cause
By blocking traffic DOVER was their fatal mistake

YOU CAN NOT BLOCK TRAFFIC TO OUR EUROPEAN PARTNERS
Even though, we brexit with no deal, on this "Witching hour of Halloween"

Why Oh Why Climate change activists
Did you sell your souls?
To these extinction activists

For you have
Extinguished any credibility
In your climate change cause!

Sep 22, 2019
old C
You have less and less credibility as you claim emergencies that are just NOT emergencies
But I don't do that. I defer to the science - that says that our planet is warming - and that this poses a serious problem. I do not say this - so it has nothing to do with my credibility. The scientists who spend their lives studying this topic say it.

Perhaps you were unaware that 'comparison' and 'analogy' are synonymous in their meaning
Your statement is redundant, and also not true. A comparison is different than an analogy.
And YOU are complaining about Capitalism?
Yes.

Sep 22, 2019
Your insensibility and insanity has some use, @antigoracle; as your commensurably inept efforts affords opportunities for me and others to refute the usual anti-climate-science spiels you and others like you have long been paid to post on the internet. Unfortunately for you, your fellows, and your paymasters, the reality is catching up with both their destructive/miscreant business models/profits and what's left of your and your fellows' sanity....as demonstrated by your latest series of low-grade crap-trolls, which must be sorely disappointing your paymasters. Pity.

Yeah @RC, that sure sounds like the sane ramblings of the village idiot.

Sep 22, 2019
Stop your whinging, ice free is within normal bounds.


Sep 22, 2019
But I don't do that. I defer to the science


Like the green new deal? lol

Sep 22, 2019
@S_E_U.
Go tell that to all the millions affected when UNPRECEDENTED THREE 'monster' Hurricanes (Harvey, Irma, Maria) struck the US in rapid succession in 2017. And already THIS year two major hurricanes created devastation in Bahamas and on US east coast. The story is similar for the Typhoons in Asia and major storms elsewhere. They're getting UNPRECEDENTEDLY bigger, slower, more damaging and such close succession that recovery is almost impossible before the next one hits. Wake up and get with the REALITY NOW, mate. :)

https://en.wikipe...urricane
Of course there've always been hurricanes, but the pre-industrial revolution era was characterised with RARE 'monster' Hurricanes, whenever RARE unusual conditions coincided due to unusual wind and water temps/patterns. The point I made, and that you apparently missed, is that NOW (ie, 2017) there were THREE 'monster' Hurricanes...IN ONE YEAR. Has that got through? Its the evolving TREND NOW. :)

Sep 22, 2019
@S_E_U.
It is 'Free Capitalism' that has provided humans in the western world the opportunities to assume levels of wealth through a good education and chances for a better future due to that Free Capitalism. This type of Capitalism not only allows wealth for honest individuals, but also for the greater part of the citizenry who are also willing to work with that system. It also makes possible the provision of Charities where individuals are free to donate funds to help others who are in need.
No, @S_E_U, early 'Free Capitalism' was responsible for CHILDREN DYING down the mines and in the mills; and for the crushing POVERTY in Dickensian times DESPITE 'having a job' in those 'free capitalist' slave-condition 'capitalist enterprises'. I was also "free Capitalism' that led to the slaughter of native populations who objected to being forced into slavery and having their land and resources stolen. It was SOCIALLY REGULATED Capitalism that gave us all the benefits. Read the history. :)

Sep 22, 2019
@antigoracle.
Your insensibility and insanity has some use, @antigoracle; as your commensurably inept efforts affords opportunities for me and others to refute the usual anti-climate-science spiels you and others like you have long been paid to post on the internet. Unfortunately for you, your fellows, and your paymasters, the reality is catching up with both their destructive/miscreant business models/profits and what's left of your and your fellows' sanity....as demonstrated by your latest series of low-grade crap-trolls, which must be sorely disappointing your paymasters. Pity.

Yeah @RC, that sure sounds like the sane ramblings of the village idiot.
Infinitely better than the INsane ramblings of the 'weaponised stupid' and/or 'denialist-programmed bot', @antigoracle. Obviously. :)

Sep 22, 2019
@S_E_U.
Go tell that to all the millions affected when UNPRECEDENTED THREE 'monster' Hurricanes (Harvey, Irma, Maria) struck the US in rapid succession in 2017. And already THIS year two major hurricanes created devastation in Bahamas and on US east coast. The story is similar for the Typhoons in Asia and major storms elsewhere. They're getting UNPRECEDENTEDLY bigger, slower, more damaging and such close succession that recovery is almost impossible before the next one hits. Wake up and get with the REALITY NOW, mate. :)

https://en.wikipe...urricane
Of course there've always been hurricanes, but the pre-industrial revolution era was characterised with RARE 'monster' Hurricanes
says RC

Three big hurricanes in 2017 was 2 years ago. So far in the year 2019 there hasn't been very many that you could say was 'massive' in any way.
Incidentally, hurricanes serve a useful purpose where they stir up the ocean bottoms that need mixing.

Sep 22, 2019
@S_E_U.
It is 'Free Capitalism' that has provided humans in the western world the opportunities to assume levels of wealth...
No, @S_E_U, early 'Free Capitalism' was responsible for CHILDREN DYING down the mines and in the mills; and for the crushing POVERTY in Dickensian times DESPITE 'having a job' in those 'free capitalist' slave-condition 'capitalist enterprises'. I was also "free Capitalism' that led to the slaughter of native populations who objected to being forced into slavery and having their land and resources stolen. It was SOCIALLY REGULATED Capitalism that gave us all the benefits. Read the history. :)
says RC

It is apparent that you have no clue as to what 'Free Capitalism' is. Children working in the mines is slavery - nothing free about that, RC. And slavery has nothing to do with Free Capitalism at all.
The Capitalism that you refer to is 'Crony Capitalism' where Obama e.g. provided Solyndra with Capital, the union members voted for Obama and then....

Sep 22, 2019
-contd-
....and then Solyndra went out of business (after being awarded millions in American taxpayer money. ) Solyndra was an American solar panel manufacturer. Crony Capitalism paid off very well for Solyndra. Obama got his votes from the members and the company claimed bankruptcy, IIRC.

Incidentally RC, there are children working in mines in African countries and in other places in the world. The leaders of such countries have no idea what Free Capitalism is - because they are, for the most part, DICTATORSHIPS. And don't forget the children who are encouraged by their Muslim elders to strap explosives around their bodies to blow themselves up in a crowd of unbelievers. No Free Capitalism there either, RC.
Slavery is happening in African nations that are ruled by dictators, as we speak. The only Capitalism that is happening in these places involve the loot going into he pockets of the dictators and their henchmen. That would be the Crony type. China does that type also.

Sep 22, 2019
Of course there've always been hurricanes, but the pre-industrial revolution era was characterised with RARE 'monster' Hurricanes, whenever RARE unusual conditions coincided due to unusual wind and water temps/patterns. The point I made, and that you apparently missed, is that NOW (ie, 2017) there were THREE 'monster' Hurricanes...IN ONE YEAR. Has that got through? Its the evolving TREND NOW. :)

Yeah @RC, of course there have always been stupid crazy people, but, your RARE unusual condition of insanity coinciding with utter stupidity, is characterized with FREQUENT 'monster' loads of crap, whenever your conditions coincided due to you not taking your insanity pills. Its the evolving TREND NOW. :)
You obviously missed, what we in reality, call facts.
http://www.hurric...ric.html

Sep 22, 2019
@S_E_U.
No, @S_E_U, early 'Free Capitalism' was responsible for CHILDREN DYING down the mines and in the mills; and for the crushing POVERTY in Dickensian times DESPITE 'having a job' in those 'free capitalist' slave-condition 'capitalist enterprises'. I was also "free Capitalism' that led to the slaughter of native populations who objected to being forced into slavery and having their land and resources stolen. It was SOCIALLY REGULATED Capitalism that gave us all the benefits. Read the history. :)
It is apparent that you have no clue as to what 'Free Capitalism' is. Children working in the mines is slavery - nothing free about that, RC. And slavery has nothing to do with Free Capitalism at all.
It is "Free Capitalism" that "offshores' operations to take advantage of SLAVE LABOUR and exploitative/inhuman employment conditions in countries like China and other 'NON-FREE-capitalism' countries. Mate, get real/informed about history....and CURRENT realities also. :)

Sep 22, 2019
-contd-
And by the way, RealityCheck
Since you are now an "ANTI-CAPITALIST", I will now reques that YOU give me HALF of all your wealth OR whatever is in your bank accounts, all the money that is in your wallet, and continue to subsidise me and my human host and his friends for the rest of your life. You see what it is, RC, we are all poor and my human host has fallen on hard times, business wise. So if you are a charitable human, you will give us at least HALF OF YOUR CAPITAL that is sitting in your wallet.
I have requested the same of another anticapitalist by the name of George Kamburoff. But he never got back to me with regard to my demand/request.
So now that we all understand that you have a hatred toward Capitalism, it should be easy for you to distribute your personal Capital/wealth to all of us who are poor and down-and-out.
Please send us a money order payable to SEU in care of phys.org administrators. They will know to whom the proceeds will go. Thank you in advance. :)

Sep 22, 2019
Of course there've always been hurricanes, but the pre-industrial revolution era was characterised with RARE 'monster' Hurricanes, whenever RARE unusual conditions coincided due to unusual wind and water temps/patterns. The point I made, and that you apparently missed, is that NOW (ie, 2017) there were THREE 'monster' Hurricanes...IN ONE YEAR. Has that got through? Its the evolving TREND NOW. :)
You obviously missed, what we in reality, call facts.
http://www.hurric...ric.html
Your own linked data proves my point re the trending clustering/intensity etc. Your data shows earlier damaging hurricanes many decades between them; and the frequency/clustering/severity etc is increasing towards current times as CO2 increased. The proof is now in by your own linked data and by current events. Your failure is now evident to all, @antigoracle. As has been your 'weaponised stupidity and malevolence' doing the bidding of miscreant Russian/GOP/Fossil interests. Bad.

Sep 22, 2019
@S_E_U.

Since you are now an "ANTI-CAPITALIST", I will now reques that YOU give me HALF of all your wealth OR whatever is in your bank accounts, all the money that is in your wallet, and continue to subsidise me and my human host and his friends for the rest of your life. You see what it is, RC, we are all poor and my human host has fallen on hard times, business wise. So if you are a charitable human, you will give us at least HALF OF YOUR CAPITAL that is sitting in your wallet.
I have requested the same of another anticapitalist by the name of George Kamburoff. But he never got back to me with regard to my demand/request.)
Don't be silly, mate. I'm only against UNFETTERED 'capitalism'; or ANY OTHER kind of UNFETTERED anti-social 'ism' (be it communism/fascism/religionism etc). There's a big difference between socially regulated capitalism which we in democratic nations enjoy; and the sort of 'isms' that are based on exploitation/monopolising/coercion etc. Learn, mate. :)

Sep 22, 2019
Uh, what exactly do you mean by "weaponised stupidity", RC? I have never heard such a term before. How is stupidity 'weaponised' in the first place. And why would you or anyone insist that stupidity can be weaponised? And does that include YOUR OWN stupidity, RC? Kindly help us to comprehend such a useless term. Thanks.

Sep 22, 2019
@S_E_U.
Uh, what exactly do you mean by "weaponised stupidity", RC? I have never heard such a term before. How is stupidity 'weaponised' in the first place. And why would you or anyone insist that stupidity can be weaponised? And does that include YOUR OWN stupidity, RC? Kindly help us to comprehend such a useless term. Thanks.
Didn't you say you were a 'mere scholar", mate? So do some research by googling the term, instead of asking me to explain a phrase which you should already have come across in your "scholarly research". Get back to me once you have done your due diligence, "mere Scholar". :)

Sep 22, 2019
@S_E_U.
No, @S_E_U, early 'Free Capitalism' was responsible for CHILDREN DYING down the mines and in the mills; and for the crushing POVERTY in Dickensian times DESPITE 'having a job' in those 'free capitalist' slave-condition 'capitalist enterprises'. I was also "free Capitalism' that led to the slaughter of native populations who objected to being forced into slavery and having their land and resources stolen. It was SOCIALLY REGULATED Capitalism that gave us all the benefits. Read the history. :)
It is apparent that you have no clue as to what 'Free Capitalism' is. Children working in the mines is slavery - nothing free about that, RC. And slavery has nothing to do with Free Capitalism at all.
It is "Free Capitalism" that "offshores' operations to take advantage of SLAVE LABOUR and exploitative/inhuman employment conditions in countries like China and other 'NON-FREE-capitalism' countries.


You have no idea the meaning of FREE Capitalism, RC.

Sep 22, 2019
@S_E_U.
..early 'Free Capitalism' was responsible for CHILDREN DYING down the mines and in the mills; and for the crushing POVERTY in Dickensian times DESPITE 'having a job' in those 'free capitalist' slave-condition 'capitalist enterprises'. I was also "free Capitalism' that led to the slaughter of native populations who objected to being forced into slavery and having their land and resources stolen. It was SOCIALLY REGULATED Capitalism that gave us all the benefits. Read the history. :)
...And slavery has nothing to do with Free Capitalism at all.
It is "Free Capitalism" that "offshores' operations to take advantage of SLAVE LABOUR and exploitative/inhuman employment conditions in countries like China and other 'NON-FREE-capitalism' countries.
You have no idea the meaning of FREE Capitalism, RC. You come across as a 'babe in the woods' regarding the historical/modern realities of the capitalist system's faults/benefits, @S_E_U. Wiki "Laissez-faire", mate. :)

Sep 22, 2019
@RC
Perhaps you are still unaware that countries like Central America, China and others have their own currency, in which their citizens earn their salaries IN THOSE CURRENCIES, RC. When American Capitalist companies go abroad to have their products manufactured in other countries by the indigenous workers, they are not paying those workers in USDollars, the workers are being paid in whichever currency is USED in that country. But US companies are not paying low wages in comparison to the wages paid normally to indigenous workers. These workers get paid far more tha they would be paid otherwise. So that they are better paid for their work and are encouraged to produce better workmanship because they are getting a better salary. There is no slave labor going on in these countries who are paid IN THEIR OWN CURRENCY by American companies. This is due to FREE CAPITALISM, and the Capitalists are repaid with superiour production.

Sep 22, 2019
@S_E_U.
@RC
Perhaps you are still unaware that countries like Central America, China and others have their own currency, in which their citizens earn their salaries IN THOSE CURRENCIES, RC. When American Capitalist companies go abroad to have their products manufactured in other countries by the indigenous workers, they are not paying those workers in USDollars, the workers are being paid in whichever currency is USED in that country. But US companies are not paying low wages in comparison to the wages paid normally to indigenous workers. These workers get paid far more tha they would be paid otherwise. So that they are better paid for their work and are encouraged to produce better workmanship because they are getting a better salary. There is no slave labor going on in these countries who are paid IN THEIR OWN CURRENCY by American companies. This is due to FREE CAPITALISM, and the Capitalists are repaid with superiour production.
Get real, @S_E_U. Research 'modern slavery'. :)

Sep 22, 2019
REFORMAT:
@S_E_U.
early 'Free Capitalism' was responsible for CHILDREN DYING down the mines and in the mills; and for the crushing POVERTY in Dickensian times DESPITE 'having a job' in those 'free capitalist' slave-condition 'capitalist enterprises'. I was also "free Capitalism' that led to the slaughter of native populations who objected to being forced into slavery and having their land and resources stolen. It was SOCIALLY REGULATED Capitalism that gave us all the benefits. Read the history. :)
And slavery has nothing to do with Free Capitalism at all.
It is "Free Capitalism" that "offshores' operations to take advantage of SLAVE LABOUR and exploitative/inhuman employment conditions in countries like China/other 'NON-FREE-capitalism' countries.
You have no idea the meaning of FREE Capitalism, RC.
You come across as a 'babe in the woods' regarding the historical/modern realities of the capitalist system's faults/benefits, @S_E_U. Wiki "Laissez-faire", mate. :)

Sep 22, 2019
Modern slavery only occurs in countries that have always taken advantage of their own people, and where Slavery had been instilled as a normal and natural process perhaps thousands of years ago in those countries. Slavery never left those countries and was never abolished.
In the US, slavery was abolished in the aftermath of the Civil War in the 1800s and in England even earlier. Slavery still is the norm in the middle eastern countries, as well as in African and certain parts of Asia. Is there any slavery in the US, GB or in Europe now? Not at all.
I would advise you to travel to the middle east to lecture their leaders to stop slavery. See where it gets you.

Sep 22, 2019
"Laissez-faire" Capitalism is what is occurring now in the US. And the economy in the US is fantastically great when compared to the 8 years of the Obama administration when he attempted to run the US economy into the ground. I remember it well, so don't try to bamboozle me, RC. And there is no slavery in the US; the unemployment figures are very low; employment is very high amounts minorities and women; and the companies are coming back to the US from abroad.
We are doing fine here, thank you.

Sep 22, 2019
@S_E_U.
Modern slavery only occurs in countries that have always taken advantage of their own people, and where Slavery had been instilled as a normal and natural process perhaps thousands of years ago in those countries. Slavery never left those countries and was never abolished.
In the US, slavery was abolished in the aftermath of the Civil War in the 1800s and in England even earlier. Slavery still is the norm in the middle eastern countries, as well as in African and certain parts of Asia. Is there any slavery in the US, GB or in Europe now? Not at all.
I would advise you to travel to the middle east to lecture their leaders to stop slavery.
You are woefully uninformed/naive, mate. Research about "Wage Theft", other insidious practices, that have been rife since time immemorial. Some more recent examples (even here in OZ!) of would-be 'free capitalists' surreptitiously 'sidestepping' regulations/stealing/underpaying workers at "Seven Eleven" and other "franchises". Research.

Sep 22, 2019
@S_E_U.
"Laissez-faire" Capitalism is what is occurring now in the US. And the economy in the US is fantastically great when compared to the 8 years of the Obama administration when he attempted to run the US economy into the ground. I remember it well, so don't try to bamboozle me, RC. And there is no slavery in the US; the unemployment figures are very low; employment is very high amounts minorities and women; and the companies are coming back to the US from abroad.
We are doing fine here, thank you.
@S_E_U, you're terribly confused. Western Democracies have REGULATED capitalist system (even up to and including INTERNATIONAL TREATIES and LAWS). Please pause in your confusion and actually research/understand more deeply the subtleties and realities of the relevant subjects/topics you have been opining about to me in our above exchange so far. Good luck and enjoy the learning experience, mate. :)

Sep 22, 2019
I don't concern myself with convenience stores, as they are not high paying and their customer/clientele can be intermittent. Every other business concern is most often in contracts with their unions. Union members who understand good business practices would KNOW that it is the CONSUMER who determines the wages/salaries of each worker. It is understood by most that if business falls off due to less consumers coming in to purchase whatever, then the business can't afford to pay higher wages. It is ALL in the debits and credits data that determines wages. Those who are misinformed or never learnt good business practices are doomed to march in demonstrations thinking that they will be paid higher wages through that method. It doesn't work that way.

Sep 22, 2019
@S_E_U.
I don't concern myself with convenience stores, as they are not high paying and their customer/clientele can be intermittent. Every other business concern is most often in contracts with their unions. Union members who understand good business practices would KNOW that it is the CONSUMER who determines the wages/salaries of each worker. It is understood by most that if business falls off due to less consumers coming in to purchase whatever, then the business can't afford to pay higher wages. It is ALL in the debits and credits data that determines wages. Those who are misinformed or never learnt good business practices are doomed to march in demonstrations thinking that they will be paid higher wages through that method. It doesn't work that way.
Do you even realise that 'Free Capitalism" proponents want to BAN UNIONS altogether because they get in the way of making more profits at the expense of the workers pay and conditions, mate? Please...do more research, @S_E_U. :)

Sep 22, 2019
Well RC. you have YOUR opinions and I have mine. But your opinions are not in keeping with the economics of the US and GB. Since you live in Australia, whatever your political and economic system is, YOU have to live with it. I/we are happy here in the States, and I can only hope that Brexit will happen next month in England.
That is all I will say to you, at least for now. Good luck there in Oz.

Apparently you fail to understand what I've said about unions and the US economy. Unions will always have a place in that economy, as long as they understand that their wages are actually PAID BY CONSUMERS. The customers who buy their products, not the CEO.

Sep 22, 2019
@S_E_U.
Well RC. you have YOUR opinions and I have mine. But your opinions are not in keeping with the economics of the US and GB. Since you live in Australia, whatever your political and economic system is, YOU have to live with it. I/we are happy here in the States, and I can only hope that Brexit will happen next month in England.
That is all I will say to you, at least for now. Good luck there in Oz.
Thanks for your well-wishes, mate. Same to you. But in the meantime please do more and deeper research into the topics/subjects you have opined on; because you will find that, whatever differences between democracies/capitalist systems in the 'Western World', the interconnecting/international treaties/laws have the same UNDERLYING theme: REGULATION and SOCIAL RESPONSIBILITY; which are totally diametrically opposed to the old/failed "Laissez Faire" (unregulated) capitalism system. Good luck and enjoy the learning, mate. :)

Sep 22, 2019
RC, I have just explained to you that it is the CUSTOMER THAT PAYS THE WORKER, not the CEO. You are not paying attention to that fact. The customer is the one who BUYS the products and that money goes toward paying the electric bill and other expenditures that the company has to pay to exist. Only then is the remainder of that money from customers paid to the workers. And the company owners, investors, etc. have to wait their turn. You seem to think that most of the money goes to the CEO and the board of directors, etc. It doesn't. THEY get their share as an afterthought.

Sep 22, 2019
@S_E_U.
RC, I have just explained to you that it is the CUSTOMER THAT PAYS THE WORKER, not the CEO. You are not paying attention to that fact. The customer is the one who BUYS the products and that money goes toward paying the electric bill and other expenditures that the company has to pay to exist. Only then is the remainder of that money from customers paid to the workers. And the company owners, investors, etc. have to wait their turn. You seem to think that most of the money goes to the CEO and the board of directors, etc. It doesn't. THEY get their share as an afterthought.
Haven't you been watching the increasing trend for shareholders revolts against excessive remuneration of CEOs who often get BONUSES even while the company is FAILING? Get better informed and real, mate. Any business that can't survive doing the right thing by ALL 'stakeholders' (workers, management, shareholders) is doomed to fail anyway. Enter: more honest/competent management/investment. :)

Sep 23, 2019
@S_E_U.
RC, I have just explained to you that it is the CUSTOMER THAT PAYS THE WORKER, not the CEO.... The customer is the one who BUYS the products and that money goes toward paying the electric bill and other expenditures that the company has to pay to exist. Only then is the remainder of that money from customers paid to the workers. And the company owners, investors, etc. have to wait their turn. You seem to think that most of the money goes to the CEO and the board of directors, etc. It doesn't. THEY get their share as an afterthought.
Haven't you been watching the increasing trend for shareholders revolts against excessive remuneration of CEOs who often get BONUSES even while the company is FAILING?Any business that can't survive doing the right thing by ALL 'stakeholders' (workers, management, shareholders) is doomed to fail anyway. Enter: more honest/competent management/investment. :)
says RC

Is that true of ALL American companies? Only in your imagination.

Sep 23, 2019
The vast majority of American companies who provide goods and/or services are doing very well, which is why the economy has never been so good as it is now. I/we live here in the US and understand perfectly well the health of the economy. Any time that there seems to be discord between company management and workers, it is most often due to a push for higher wages. They are only accommodated when and IF business is brisk and very good. If not, then it is explained to workers/unions that business has to pick up before being able to afford to pay higher wages.
Any CEO and other higher officers who pocket a lot of the profits illegally will be fired from their position and someone else will take his/her place. This is the way business is done. Everyone has to pull their own weight and work together well for the sake of the company.

I have no idea how it is done in Australia, but here in the States, shirkers are removed swiftly.

Sep 23, 2019
Regarding the glacier surface melt in the antarctic, there is nothing that can be done to prevent it. AFAIK, it is summer at the South Pole, but I will check to see if that's correct. Winter will soon be here and the situation could change.

Sep 23, 2019
UNFETTEREDISM'S by RealityCheck

Don't be silly
mate
I'm only against
UNFETTERED capitalism
or ANY OTHER kind
of UNFETTERED
anti-social ism
be it communism
fascism
religionism
etc
There's a big difference
between socially regulated capitalism
which we
in democratic nations enjoy
and the sort of isms
that are based
on exploitation
monopolising
coercion
etc
Learn, mate. :)

RealityCheck this Residential Accommodation, is your Grassy River Bank, your Bridge of Unfetteredism

Sep 23, 2019
Your own linked data proves my point re the trending clustering/intensity etc. Your data shows earlier damaging hurricanes many decades between them; and the frequency/clustering/severity etc is increasing towards current times as CO2 increased.

Oh @RC, my data confirms your stupidity. Prior to modern technology, reporting of hurricanes would have been sparse and limited to ones that impacted human settlements. Before soiling the forum with your raging stupidity, try checking facts.
In a stroke of luck, no major hurricanes rated Category 3 or higher have struck U.S. soil during the past nine years, a new study finds.
This is the country's longest "hurricane drought" in recorded history, or since 1851, the researchers said. The previous record lull lasted eight years, from 1861 to 1868, they said.

https://www.lives...ght.html
Of course, just like you, they claim it's "luck", when it debunks your global warming lies.

Sep 23, 2019
More AGW Cult lies for their hungry ignorant sheep.
Even at the height of summer, the Antarctic peninsula stays freezing.
https://www.coola...ther.php

Combine this with the high albedo of ice and the extremely low humidity, sunlight combined with any amount of the magical CO2, will not melt any of it. In fact, where I am, winter temperatures in the teens, does not melt the snow, rather, it sublimates because of the low humidity.
What the AGW Cult is fooling their ignorant flock with, here, is the result of summer rainfall. Unlike the East Antarctic, the peninsula is narrow, thus rain can reach further inland.
Hey Chicken Littles remember falling for this lie. Notice the dark clouds and raindrops. Tell me how could the ice be melting while the sun is completely blocked by those dark clouds. Oh, wait, I forgot, CO2 is magical.
https://dailyofth...er-lake/

Sep 23, 2019
@antigoracle.
Your own linked data proves my point re the trending clustering/intensity etc. Your data shows earlier damaging hurricanes many decades between them; and the frequency/clustering/severity etc is increasing towards current times as CO2 increased.
Oh @RC, my data confirms your stupidity. Prior to modern technology, reporting of hurricanes would have been sparse and limited to ones that impacted human settlements. Before soiling the forum with your raging stupidity, try checking facts.
In a stroke of luck, no major hurricanes rated Category 3 or higher have struck U.S. soil during the past nine years, a new study finds.
https://www.livescience.com/50704-hurricane-drought.html
Of course, just like you, they claim it's "luck", when it debunks your global warming lies.
You are a stupifyingly ignorant/parochial denialist stooge. The WORLD is more than just USA. Your link CONFIRMS that MANY Hurricanes did NOT make it to US, BUT hit OTHER nations/islands. :)

Sep 23, 2019
@S_E_U.
Any CEO and other higher officers who pocket a lot of the profits illegally will be fired from their position and someone else will take his/her place. This is the way business is done. Everyone has to pull their own weight and work together well for the sake of the company.

I have no idea how it is done in Australia, but here in the States, shirkers are removed swiftly.
You're in naive fantasyland, mate. The reality is more brutal than you seem to realise. The combination of Insider Trading, Wage Theft, Secret CEO salary-offset deals, and just plain financial fraud/embezzlement exacerbated by incompetent CEOs who even get 'bonuses' as their company is heading for the rocks....all add up to huge proportion of the wealth generated by workers being diverted to OFFSHORE TAX HAVENS hidden well away from you and the Inland Revenue Service. Or are you now going to tell me you haven't heard about Tax Havens Exposures due to the 'Panama Papers' and other scandals, @S_E_U? :)

Sep 23, 2019
You are a stupifyingly ignorant/parochial denialist stooge. The WORLD is more than just USA.

Yes @RC, the world is more than the US. So, who was the stupifyingly ignorant/parochial ALARMIST stooge, who brayed the following.
Go tell that to all the millions affected when UNPRECEDENTED THREE 'monster' Hurricanes (Harvey, Irma, Maria) struck the US in rapid succession in 2017


Go take your insanity pills so that we can safely ridicule your stupidity, you jackass.

Sep 23, 2019
@S_E_U.
Any CEO and other higher officers who pocket a lot of the profits illegally...

I have no idea how it is done in Australia, but here in the States, shirkers are removed swiftly.
You're in naive fantasyland, mate. The reality is more brutal than you seem to realise. The combination of Insider Trading, Wage Theft, Secret CEO salary-offset deals, and just plain financial fraud/embezzlement exacerbated by incompetent CEOs who even get 'bonuses' as their company is heading for the rocks....all add up to huge proportion of the wealth generated by workers being diverted to OFFSHORE TAX HAVENS hidden well away from you and the Inland Revenue Service. Or are you now going to tell me you haven't heard about Tax Havens Exposures due to the 'Panama Papers' and other scandals, @S_E_U? :)
says RC

There are those who are dishonest, but they are soon found out and must face the Regulatory system where they will pay a fine and go to trial for their misdemeanors.

Sep 24, 2019
There are many who believe that they could steal and engage in criminal/sinful activities, but the Laws are such that they will soon be punished in some way for their crimes. They are human, and humans sometimes make mistakes, whether intentionally or not. But all have to pay for their sins sooner or later, even if it was unintentional. When such things occur, it changes the future even if a tiny bit. And such changes are unfair to what could be future generations and events.

Sep 24, 2019
old c
Like the green new deal? lol
So interesting right - that you don't understand - that the green new deal - is politics, not science?

Sep 24, 2019
old c
Like the green new deal? lol
So interesting right - that you don't understand - that the green new deal - is politics, not science?
says greenonions

Well, of course the "green new deal" is all about politics and having nothing to do with science. It is similar to the "extinction rebellion" of Great Britain that is all about political activism and to block traffic and commerce. This is what they DO. There is nothing glorious or sanctified in their end goals. They just want to hasten the arrival of SOCIALISM and COMMUNISM in all free countries. They are haters of freedom, liberty and independent thought/opinion. They are working toward shutting you up, where comment sections such as this will be a thing of the past.

Sep 27, 2019
Well, of course the "green new deal" is all about politics
And we are discussing the science of melting glaciers. As usual - the discussion is immediately shifted to politics - as you accurately point out. What is says to me - is that Conservatives have lost the argument about the science - and so just turn every comment into a paranoid rant about socialism, communism, and losing your freedoms. I personally am not a communist, or a socialist, and I am very passionate about freedom. So you and I have no issue to debate there. AND - those kinds of issues have no bearing on the science of climate change. The reality of the environmental crisis we are currently facing - is not liberal or conservative.

Sep 28, 2019
@antigoracle.
You are a stupefyingly ignorant/parochial denialist stooge. The WORLD is more than just USA.
Yes @RC, the world is more than the US. So, who was the stupifyingly ignorant/parochial ALARMIST stooge, who brayed the following.
Go tell that to all the millions affected when UNPRECEDENTED THREE 'monster' Hurricanes (Harvey, Irma, Maria) struck the US in rapid succession in 2017
Go take your insanity pills so that we can safely ridicule your stupidity, you jackass.
Mate, if you had NOT been 'reading' and 'understanding' like a stupid 'bot', you would have got the salient point made: THREE MONSTER HURRICANES IN RAPID SUCCESSION FORMING IN THE SAME YEAR REGARDLESS OF WHETHER THEY HIT THE USA OR NOT.

Recall what I have always stressed: GLOBAL TREND is for cluster/extreme storms to increase in frequency/scale, irrespective of where they form or where they hit. So, @antigoracle, please show the forum that you are not a stupid 'bot' in future. Good luck. :)

Sep 28, 2019
@S_E_U.
You're in naive fantasyland, mate. The reality is more brutal than you seem to realise. The combination of Insider Trading, Wage Theft, Secret CEO salary-offset deals, and just plain financial fraud/embezzlement exacerbated by incompetent CEOs who even get 'bonuses' as their company is heading for the rocks....all add up to huge proportion of the wealth generated by workers being diverted to OFFSHORE TAX HAVENS hidden well away from you and the Inland Revenue Service. Or are you now going to tell me you haven't heard about Tax Havens Exposures due to the 'Panama Papers' and other scandals, @S_E_U? :)
There are those who are dishonest, but they are soon found out and must face the Regulatory system where they will pay a fine and go to trial for their misdemeanors.
The extreme damage they do for years before exposure is what makes it naive to pretend 'free' capitalism is in any way 'good'; because the system makes recovery by victims almost impossible. Beware. :)

Sep 28, 2019
no trend in tropopause warming , from aircraft records

https://www.atmos...Fkl9q47U

and where is that pesky tropopause anyway ? it goes up and down a lot , driven by surface temps

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