Is an understanding of dark matter around the corner? Experimentalists unsure

dark matter
A massive cluster of yellowish galaxies, seemingly caught in a red and blue spider web of eerily distorted background galaxies, makes for a spellbinding picture from the new Advanced Camera for Surveys aboard NASA's Hubble Space Telescope. To make this unprecedented image of the cosmos, Hubble peered straight through the center of one of the most massive galaxy clusters known, called Abell 1689. The gravity of the cluster's trillion stars — plus dark matter — acts as a 2-million-light-year-wide lens in space. This gravitational lens bends and magnifies the light of the galaxies located far behind it. Some of the faintest objects in the picture are probably over 13 billion light-years away (redshift value 6). Strong gravitational lensing as observed by the Hubble Space Telescope in Abell 1689 indicates the presence of dark matter. Credit: NASA, N. Benitez (JHU), T. Broadhurst (Racah Institute of Physics/The Hebrew University), H. Ford (JHU), M. Clampin (STScI),G. Hartig (STScI), G. Illingworth (UCO/Lick Observatory), the ACS Science Team and ESA

Scientists have long known that dark matter is out there, silently orchestrating the universe's movement and structure. But what exactly is dark matter made of? And what does a dark matter particle look like? That remains a mystery, with experiment after experiment coming up empty handed in the quest to detect these elusive particles.

With some luck, that may be about to change. With ten times the sensitivity of previous detectors, three recently funded experiments have scientists crossing their fingers that they may finally glimpse these long-sought particles. In recent conversations with The Kavli Foundation, scientists working on these new experiments expressed hope that they would catch dark matter, but also agreed that, in the end, their success or failure is up to nature to decide.

"Nature is being coy," said Enectali Figueroa-Feliciano, an associate professor of physics at the MIT Kavli Institute for Astrophysics and Space Research who works on one of the three new experiments. "There's something we just don't understand about the internal structure of how the universe works. When theorists write down all the ways dark matter might interact with our particles, they find, for the simplest models, that we should have seen it already. So even though we haven't found it yet, there's a message there, one that we're trying to decode now."

The first of the new experiments, called the Axion Dark Matter eXperiment, searches for a theoretical type of called the axion. ADMX seeks evidence of this extremely lightweight particle converting into a photon in the experiment's high magnetic field. By slowly varying the magnetic field, the detector hunts for one axion mass at a time.

"We've demonstrated that we have the tools necessary to see axions," said Gray Rybka, research assistant professor of physics at the University of Washington who co-leads the ADMX Gen 2 experiment. "With Gen2, we're buying a very, very powerful refrigerator that will arrive very shortly. Once it arrives, we'll be able to scan very, very quickly and we feel we'll have a much better chance of finding axions – if they're out there."

The two other new experiments look for a different type of theoretical dark matter called the WIMP. Short for Weakly Interacting Massive Particle, the WIMP interacts with our world very weakly and very rarely. The Large Underground Xenon, or LUX, experiment, which began in 2009, is now getting an upgrade to increase its sensitivity to heavier WIMPs. Meanwhile, the Super Cryogenic Dark Matter Search collaboration, which has looked for the signal of a lightweight WIMP barreling through its detector since 2013, is in the process of finalizing the design for a new experiment to be located in Canada.

"In a way it's like looking for gold," said Figueroa-Feliciano, a member of the SuperCDMS experiment. "Harry has his pan and he's looking for gold in a deep pond, and we're looking in a slightly shallower pond, and Gray's a little upstream, looking in his own spot. We don't know who's going to find gold because we don't know where it is."

Rybka agreed, but added the more optimistic perspective that it's also possible that all three experiments will find dark matter. "There's nothing that would require dark matter to be made of just one type of particle except us hoping that it's that simple," he said. "Dark matter could be one-third axions, one-third heavy WIMPs and one-third light WIMPs. That would be perfectly allowable from everything we've seen."

Yet the nugget of gold for which all three experiments search is a very valuable one. And even though the search is difficult, all three scientists agreed that it's worthwhile because glimpsing dark matter would reveal insight into a large portion of the universe.

"We're all looking and somewhere, maybe even now, there's a little bit of data that will cause someone to have an 'Ah ha!' moment," said Harry Nelson, professor of physics at the University of California, Santa Barbara and science lead for the LUX upgrade, called LUX-ZEPLIN. "This idea that there's something out there that we can't sense yet is one of those things that sends chills down my spine."


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A warm dark matter search using XMASS: Editors' suggestion of Physical Review Letters

Citation: Is an understanding of dark matter around the corner? Experimentalists unsure (2014, December 13) retrieved 21 July 2019 from https://phys.org/news/2014-12-dark-corner-experimentalists-unsure.html
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Dec 13, 2014
How many more years and millions of dollars will we spend before we decide that imaginary matter is imaginary?

Dec 13, 2014
There isn't any! Big bang theory is a misinterpretation of the cause of the background red shift.

Dec 13, 2014
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Dec 13, 2014
@Harry Nelson:
You can do without chills. If your WIMPs existed, there could not be a Galaxy full of WIMP seekers. WIMPs are incompatible with the Galaxy, so they can't exist.

Dec 13, 2014
Starlight has mass therefore the speed of light is limited. Space is full of [viscous] light.
Starlight is dark energy when we can't see it.
Just like we can't see the light from a flashlight pointing away from us, from the sun's perspective sunlight shining on the earth is dark energy it [the sun] created.
Our sun's a shining sphere but the only sunlight we see is aiming at us, the rest of it is dark energy. Matter is concentrated light.
Viscous space 'bends' around matter just like water bends around rocks above and below the surface.
The universe expands because starlight is always being created, pushing out...
String theory is actually pulse theory. Light leaves, or pulses, from a star [light generator] like sound leaves a musical instrument [sound generator].
The light we see from a star is actually part of, a remnant, of the star.

Dec 13, 2014
There is no matter, dark or otherwise. There is only energy. Matter is an expression of energy confined by superior external force, not given cohesion by internal force working at a distance and opposite in nature to all force, which works by superior and inferior density and dispersion toward absolute equality. The universe is a difference engine, and our visible portion but a small subset.

Dec 13, 2014
@Brass...'There is no matter, dark or otherwise. There is only energy. Matter is an expression of energy'

I might agree to this much, at least. If the universe is not math, but real, and composed of material extending in 3-D, what then is the smallest 3D particle actually composed of ?? And what causes the physical properties within our universe that are described mathematically as a field??

For me, it seems logical that both must be caused by something physically smaller than what can be physically-detected by the larger-sized tool-set available within our universe.

Dec 13, 2014
What you see in the sky is what happens after the light from those colossal bodies extremely far out in space reaches us, and is a distortion of the true position of those objects, and which is essentially an optical illusion. Thus, an interpretation of the effects of gravity may only be apparent and a grossly exaggerated representation of what is really there, like the shape that the circle of a beam of light striking a ceiling makes when the flashlight is tilted. That distant galaxy might actually be 34 degrees to the right and 27 degrees down from where we see it in its apparent position. We just can't tell.

After the illusion is factored out, what remains is Helium - which is non-reactive to light.

Dec 14, 2014
We are only now able to manipulate and control atomic matter and are starting to learn a thing or two about the quantum world and to me at least the results are starting/promising to be absolutely stunning. What, I wonder, will be possible when we learn how build with the other 95% of stuff in the universe? Chills down my spine indeed!

Dec 14, 2014
After the big bang there were a lot of neutrinos in the universe. If some of them had a small amount of mass would it not account for the "dark Matter?" If there are some elastic collisions with ordinary matter might it not also account for gravity?

Dec 14, 2014
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Dec 14, 2014
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Dec 14, 2014
Ren82 claimed
Red shift is not due to Dopler efect caused by expanding space and there is very simple reason for this.
Really, so simple u refuse to articulate it ?
Did your god tell u about this - how ?
Where is there any evidence please ?

Ren82 continues with mere claims
Red shift is due to physical properties of vacuum of space and gravitational influense of matter to electoermagnetic waves poropagating in cosmic space.
Please translate this & add some mathematics ?

Did your god tell u not to use mathematics in your idea about space ?

Tell me more about how little your god communicates, just like he doesnt exist, mere claims from an old book that ONLY describes: Status, Authority & Punishment !

Nothing to help anyone, even if you believe in Jesus or mohammed you STILL suffer !

Why are u here Ren82 - u drop in god/creation references on a Science yet NEVER offer ANY Science.

Appearance of U trying to obfuscate & spread dogma, U should be banned !

Dec 14, 2014
Ren82 claimed
.. light coming from distant cosmic objects will pass through areas with different rates of expansion of space, according to calculations based on redshift.
Where is there ANY evidence for:- "..pass through areas with different rates of expansion.." ?

Instead of guessing where are there ANY journals with empirical evidence for that ?

Ren82 just doesn't understand the process of Science
Moving from zone with a higher rate to an adjacent zone with a a lower rate of expansion, part of the Doppler effect will be compensated because in this zone the space shrinks compared to the previous zone
This is predicated upon your "..If.." which is based upon your claim but NO evidence :-(

Ren82 claimed
..effect of expanding space will be fully compensated when e;ectomagnetic waves arive to the observer
Where is there ANY evidence that "electromagnetic waves" will "compensate" expanding space ?

Instead of an easy claim, where is your EVIDENCE ?

Dec 14, 2014
@Mike_Massen
Couldn't redshift be due to the decay of photons over time?
Is DM produced by a fleeting interaction between axions (or as Reg Mundy refers to them, tirds) which is momentary, as opposed to long lasting interaction forming matter as we know it? If so , DM is flashing in and out of existence and the chance of it interacting with ordinary matter in one of the detectors is practically zero.

Dec 14, 2014
Ren82 doesnt under the process with this naive blurt
Read at least a little of the red shift and for Hubble law and constant instead of asking naive questions.
:-)

Ren82, U might be forgiven for not having any Science education thus lamely assuming U only need to discuss "essentials" which U decided upon & obviously has failed U dismally...!

Try to understand this:-

Scientists enter into dialectic or debate on topics with aim of an outcome & so doing develop maturity in understanding a methodology called "convergence".

It should be obvious to intelligent people there are many sources outside of formal courses Eg those that make claims re "red-shift".

If naive people arbitrarily choose their own references of sources of information without understanding formal education then the only result of those engaging in debate is divergence, ie goes no-where !

So be mature quote YOUR sources so convergence is possible.

And u call me naive - LOL !

Dec 14, 2014
Unfortunately, we consider that doesn't exist DM as particles, since the inflation needs to be viewed as a decompression of a viscoelastic spring with a constant K(G, niu), and which it was firstly compressed due of gravity (like it happen in a black hole) with an immense gravitationally energy in order to squeeze the space-time curvature at near Plank radius of 10^-35[m]. At this dimension a declick (instability) it happens as to be followed by the first pure elastic decompression (BING-BANG), or inflation, and when the curvature regains its big value 10^8[m], with the cost of near initial energy ~10^19GeV and, remaining only a small quantity ~10^3GeV as to be used to "extract" from the vacuum the matter particles, that form galaxies-planets-stars and theses modify (locally) the space-time curvature (niu). This viscosity (niu) it could assimilated with DM

Dec 14, 2014
see vixra:1410.0124
Unfortunately, we consider that doesn't exist DM as particles, since the inflation needs to be viewed as a decompression of a viscoelastic spring with a constant K(G, niu), and which it was firstly compressed due of gravity (like it happen in a black hole) with an immense gravitationally energy in order to squeeze the space-time curvature at near Plank radius of 10^-35[m]. At this dimension a declick (instability) it happens as to be followed by the first pure elastic decompression (BING-BANG), or inflation, and when the curvature regains its big value 10^8[m], with the cost of near initial energy ~10^19GeV and, remaining only a small quantity ~10^3GeV as to be used to "extract" from the vacuum the matter particles, that form galaxies-planets-stars and theses modify (locally) the space-time curvature (niu). This viscosity (niu) it could assimilated with DM

Dec 14, 2014
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Dec 14, 2014
"And even though the search is difficult, all three scientists agreed that it's worthwhile because glimpsing dark matter would..." result in a Nobel prize.

Dec 14, 2014
How many more years and millions of dollars will we spend before we decide that imaginary matter is imaginary?


...indeed, and all that is alleged to be known, is that DM is a collapsed wave, and therefore measurable-- too bad those instruments were so expensive if it isn't ... or, if the particles if they exist, are infinitely and asymptotically fractal-- composed of something, composed of something else, etc.

Dec 14, 2014
How many more years and millions of dollars will we spend before we decide that imaginary matter is imaginary?

Right, let's keep spending TRILLIONS on wars on terror and wars on drugs and worldwide electronic spying because the benefits of imaginary security far outweigh advances in science.

Dec 14, 2014
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Dec 14, 2014
The ignorance of scientists itself has caused the trillions on wars

No, Zeph – Cheney, Rumsfeld, Shrub and their ilk are most certainly not scientists. They're torturous treasonous traitors and need to be taken to the Hague immediately if not sooner.

Dec 14, 2014
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Dec 14, 2014
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Dec 14, 2014
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Dec 14, 2014
...as such a additional money would make the things even worse.

It's the additional bombs, and more of the same that put us where we are now. What scientists have ever advocated dropping more bombs on the problems we all caused by dropping bombs on problems? Who needs to be reminded what the definition of insanity is? What's more insane than trying to solve problems with deadly and destructive violence?

Dec 14, 2014
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Dec 14, 2014
It's not coordinated via conspiracy
It most certainly is, from the story of a civilian aircraft breaching Area P56 and landing on the pentagon so Rummy could, like every good general in the heat of battle does, drop everything for a photo op running along side a stretcher assisting the medics, to a bunch of mucky-mucks who could barely fly a single-engine Cessna managing to hijack and pilot sophisticated airliners and fly them without any military escort whatsoever. It's not the ignorance of scientists or architects or engineers, Zeph—it's our (we the people's) ignorance and our fault.

Dec 14, 2014
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Dec 14, 2014
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Dec 14, 2014
Do you think, some hidden force exists here and prohibits us in research

Do you have the money you need to do the research you want? Neither do I. Is that some hidden force? Only insofar as you can't see the money you don't have. You seem to think it's okay to keep spending on things military. Because oil and Crimea. And you only seem to care about up and down votes in a forum you keep getting banned from. The common people have been struggling for centuries just for basic human rights. The struggle continues...

Dec 14, 2014
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Dec 14, 2014
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Dec 14, 2014
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Dec 14, 2014
the people will not spend willingly the money in fight for oil, until it will be abundant and excessive.

The people have been out of the purse-string loop for some time. The people don't have money, most of it has trickled up. *** voodoo economics for you. The common people should consider forming a democracy. A real one, towards a more perfect union and away from privatized global corporate oligarchy.

Dec 14, 2014
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Dec 14, 2014
I've understood the nature of dark matter after five years of reading about its research - so until the other scientists aren't complete idiots, they had enough of time for to realize it too (especially with my kind help, which is publicly available at the web)
@ZZZZEPHIR
i bet you are surprised that the modern astrophysicists dont rush to beat down your door and give you the accolades you so obviously deserve, right?

I mean... what are all those silly scientists thinking? Not recognizing the brilliance of your deductions in all those published studies you've been putting out...
oh, wait...
you used REDDIT links, not STUDIES!

maybe that is a reason?

http://math.ucr.e...pot.html
http://sci-ence.o...-flags2/

MAYBE the reason that you are being ignored is BECAUSE you have:
no comprehension of the relevant physics involved?

the sad thing is... you CAN learn it for free!
http://ocw.mit.ed...=physics

Dec 14, 2014
There is evidence of dark matter every time a double slit experiment is performed; it's what waves.

Dark matter has mass. Dark matter physically occupies three dimensional space. Dark matter is physically displaced by the particles of matter which exist in it and move through it.

The Milky Way's halo is not a clump of stuff anchored to the Milky Way. The Milky Way is moving through and displacing the dark matter.

The Milky Way's halo is the state of displacement of the dark matter.

The Milky Way's halo is the deformation of spacetime.

What is referred to geometrically as the deformation of spacetime physically exists in nature as the state of displacement of the dark matter.

A moving particle has an associated dark matter displacement wave. In a double slit experiment the particle travels through a single slit and the associated wave in the dark matter passes through both.

Dec 14, 2014
The cold fusion finding will provide such a democracy automatically due to more balanced access to energy
nice pipe dream, Zephir, but ya gotta prove it works first... and so far, most of the sh*t comming out of the woodwork belongs back in the septic tank

for instance, you posted above about
I've understood the nature of dark matter after five years
and for support you linked a REDDIT page... REDDIT
not science
not relevant physics
not peer reviewed studies

PSEUDOSCIENCE AW/DAW posts

you are still willing to believe in falsified pseudoscience: http://arxiv.org/...1284.pdf
That doesn't make you some paragon of virtue and scientific purity
it makes you stupid, in the eyes of ANY educated person who see's reality
& comprehends physics/reality

it is like trying to say you comprehend complex biological processes because you use crystals and study fairies
try to get a dr or pharma-co to listen to your study with THAT in the header!

it's PSEUDOSCIENCE

Dec 14, 2014
...as such a additional money would make the things even worse.

It's the additional bombs, and more of the same that put us where we are now. What scientists have ever advocated dropping more bombs on the problems we all caused by dropping bombs on problems? Who needs to be reminded what the definition of insanity is? What's more insane than trying to solve problems with deadly and destructive violence?

This kinda reminds me of the Einstein quote -
"We can't solve problems with the same kind of thinking we used to create them..."

Dec 14, 2014
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Dec 14, 2014
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Dec 14, 2014
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Dec 14, 2014
i bet you are surprised that the modern astrophysicists dont rush to beat down your door
Kinda not, I've http://i.imgur.com/w5dpphE.gif too.
@ZEPHIR

yep... we have a good theory for your posting, too
https://en.wikipe...r_effect

you actually think you understand WTF is going on, but cannot see your own fallacious arguments because it would destroy your worldview

you CAN learn about physics for free, though
http://ocw.mit.ed...=physics

and i suggest going there to start... maybe one day you will actually understand REAL PHYSICS and then push real science instead of your other pseudoscience

it is FREE zephir
FREE
you can learn FOR FREE in your own time!

TRY IT
you will like the knowledge you receive
and people will stop making fun of you...
although it also means deleting your pseudoscience web page


Dec 14, 2014
Moderators, if you even bother to read the comments and actually respond, would you please ban Zephir/Imido/Selena AGAIN?

He is a well-known crackpot and pseudoscience troll, banned from legitimate science sites.

Make it that way here as well.

Dec 14, 2014
I "think" dark matter is actually ordinary matter existing in "parallel worlds" around us, their collective behavior reflects only the gross features of our Universe such as the collective Gravity wells of Galaxies. It is understood these "worlds" must exist to support Quantum Theory. Their combined mass/gravity is "leaking" into our Universe and can only be discerned on this larger scale. This means all attempts to discover Dark Matter will inevitably fail because these particles are "off shell" and when we find one "popping in", it appears "quite unremarkable". These phenomena are identical to the "Dirac Sea", the phenomena that crowds around familiar existing particles in our Universe, but related to "real underlying mutually interfering realities" like in Everett's Many World Theory or in the recent slightly better guess of this article "When parallel worlds collide, quantum mechanics is born" see link http://phys.org/n...ics.html

Dec 14, 2014
" I "think" dark matter is actually ordinary matter existing in "parallel worlds" around us..."

IIRC, this is a long-standing hypothesis. Still, it seems more likely to be valid than most of the, um, 'wiggly fringe' stuff posted above. Nice to read something intelligent...


Dec 14, 2014
"There's something we just don't understand about the internal structure of how the universe works."
I would say: the problem is more in admitting. Admitting that WIMPs and Axions don't function at the Galactic scale and hence can not exist.

Oh, drool on us salivary glands of knowledge! Not nearly so long as it will take for all the arm chair geniuses to actually get an education within the discipline, understand the questions and engage in the real debate. Which is also much sooner than when the people working in the area will stop and decide to listen to a self satisfied git with no experience, little education and a lot of theories that we all just can't see are brilliant.


All the credit so far goes to the astronomers who discovered the discrepancy and none to astrophysicists who who can't find it. Maybe It's time the astrophysicists, with their 30 year failure streak, turn to armchair geniuses for suggestions.

Dec 14, 2014
I am thinking that there was more clarity when Velikovsky wrote Earth in Upheaval. Now as to why the Earth was in upheaval, well, science has been remarkably reticent. It may be that the core knowledge was understood and our past 75 years has been to snip off the loose strings. I am particularly fond of Dr Paul Marmet's theory of hydrogen. I am also fond of Miles Mathis' recycling of energy taken in at the poles and emitted from the equator.

Dec 14, 2014
I was reminded by goodelfs link - Anyone seen the Schneib, lately?
Hope all is ok with him...

CDM will turn out to be something pinhead simple that we're currently looking at through the wrong end of a telescope, like gravitationally-bound (Bok) globules of hydrogen and helium which spontaneously condensed the H2 & He continuum 150 million years after the Big Bang in an observed event known as 'reionization'.

Hydrogen ionization in protostars was explained by Richard B. Larson in 1969 as the nearly isothermal gravitational collapse of H2 and He, promoted by endothermic ionization of hydrogen, and by extension, 'reionization' of the H2 & He continuum

Opaque Bok globules in the Galactic plane are merely CDM globules on disk-crossing halo orbits which OB supergiants have 'decloaked' by partially subliming the (luminous) stellar metallicity normally sequestered into icy chondrules. Over time the luminous, gaseous stellar metallicity snows out, leaving behind virtually-invisible H2 & He.

Larson (1969) Numerical calculations of the dynamics of collapsing proto-star

Dec 14, 2014
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Dec 14, 2014
I sure wish phys.org had a method of permitting users to block other users they don't wish to see in comments. I'd enjoy having a conversation with people seriously interested in science on this site, but wading through the junk comments of trolls, science illiterates and fringe nutcases is just too damn time-consuming.

Dec 14, 2014
The article does a good job of indicating future experimentation. Anyone who starts a sentence with "Dark matter is...(shoulder shrug) ending with anything other than...still a mystery, doesn't know what they're talking about.
Given voyager's confirmation of the heliopause, Zwichy, Alper and Yuri Heymann's "tired light" models may offer some insight.(the math needs tweaking though.) The only dark stuff around here is the Oort cloud.
Interesting the political commentary in this forum. Scientists cannot divorce themselves from the responsibility for modern war-machines. Advocacy or opposition is a personal choice, choose logically.

Dec 14, 2014
I sure wish phys.org had a method of permitting users to block other users they don't wish to see in comments. I'd enjoy having a conversation with people seriously interested in science on this site, but wading through the junk comments of trolls, science illiterates and fringe nutcases is just too damn time-consuming.


There is a "Ignore User" function under every comment on the right,side, just above the line separating the comments.

Dec 15, 2014
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Dec 15, 2014
I don't think dark matter will be found in the form of particles, rather as curvature of spacetime, independent of gravity, left over from the big bang.

Dec 15, 2014
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Dec 15, 2014
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Dec 15, 2014
For mainstream physicists everything is a mystery...For most of ...for theorists.
@ZEPHIR
so, somehow everyone is an idiot EXCEPT YOU then?
ri-i-i-ight! got it!

http://math.ucr.e...pot.html
http://sci-ence.o...-flags2/

dark matter is forming at the connection line of collinear massive bodies
you are still making bold conjectures not based upon ANY evidence... and all if it falls back to your acceptance of ANY person making ANY claims that are NOT MAINSTREAM SCIENCE

and you can't see how your grandstanding and biased delusional conjecture is the perfect example of the Dunning-Kruger effect?
https://en.wikipe...r_effect

your next sock puppet should be "lemon juice"

Dec 15, 2014
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Dec 15, 2014
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Dec 15, 2014
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Dec 15, 2014
This is a big mistake
@Zephir
talking to you?
or requiring evidence for your conjectures?
if there IS some reputable evidence, then you should be linking it here to support your conjecture, otherwise your continued posting has all the same authority and evidence as the Farie movement
You may imagine, that I've all accidental random findings inside the head
your words, not mine
But if you don't remember (or even denying) all findings from the past
there is so much from the past 150 years alone, to what are you referring to?
THAT is pretty much my point... but since you will only use that to bring up your failed falsified religious beliefs... i will say this: I've made a point, it is your turn to reciprocate
WHERE IS YOUR SUPPORTING EVIDENCE?
LINKS/STUDIES?

i think you should stop daydreaming and making stuff up and start here: http://ocw.mit.ed...=physics

Dec 15, 2014
This domain of debate about epistemological modelling here is taking on the distinct appearance of a ship of fools aiming for the rocks of self-destruction, desperately guided by those in the navigational know, established by repeatable empiricism, trying to save them. It's become a task to find intelligence and logic among the self-delusional hallucinations of mis-modelled reality...

Dec 15, 2014
The French-Swiss anti-cheesehole conspiracy is crumbling now we are closing in on DM candidates. They've been throwing with strings, wimps (especially the French ones) and other stinky fungus stuff, now claiming results are unsure, only to trivialize the recent signals in x-ray emissions found at Leiden university (not coincidentally a mere 10km away from GOUDA, eh?).

Remember guys, there is no dark matter, only a higher density of cheese between the holes, which can only be modeled with Dutch cheese and not that stinky stuff that conspiring CERN propagates in favour of the french/swiss cheesemarketscientists.

Dec 15, 2014
Among science trolls, dark matter trolls must be the most boring. DM is an observational fact, easily seen in the CMB or by lensing, which furthermore is part of the immensely successful LambdaCDM cosmology.

It's like trying to troll evolution: it's a fact and (part of) a theory that won't go away.

Dec 15, 2014
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Dec 15, 2014
Among science trolls, dark matter trolls must be the most boring. DM is an observational fact, easily seen in the CMB or by lensing, which furthermore is part of the immensely successful LambdaCDM cosmology.

It's like trying to troll evolution: it's a fact and (part of) a theory that won't go away.


Faith & conviction in the unseen, unproven, unknown, unprovable, untouchable, is everything that pervades the entire "Dark Matter" god in which so many of the above posters believe is not "pseudoscience". They can't prove 75% of the mass of the sun & the universe is missing, but that doesn't shake their faith in their funny farm science.

This entire DM thing is a quandary for them. So many above posters believe they must sign on to it & if they DO NOT they would be accused of promoting "pseudoscience", one of their favorite terms, this all the while they themselves have never read a single paragraph in Einstein's GR that they could understand.

Dec 15, 2014
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Dec 15, 2014
Among science trolls, dark matter trolls must be the most boring. DM is an observational fact, easily seen in the CMB or by lensing, which furthermore is part of the immensely successful LambdaCDM cosmology.

It's like trying to troll evolution: it's a fact and (part of) a theory that won't go away.


There is no "easily seen" DM in CMB. If you think so, please add a link here.
It is questionable if the lensing is done also by DM, or it were just cases of bad calculation of mass of lensing galaxies.

ΛCDM has no explicit physical theory for the origin or physical nature of dark matter or dark energy
Comparison of the model with observations is very successful on large scales (larger than galaxies, up to the observable horizon), but may have some problems on sub-galaxy scales, possibly predicting too many dwarf galaxies and too much dark matter in the innermost regions of galaxies.
Conclusion: ΛCDM is just a poor model/simulation, not a real theory.

Dec 15, 2014
Dark Matter isn't a "thing". Dark Matter can be anything. DM is a question waiting to be answered. DM is a placeholder for the explanation that will eventually resolve the counter-intuitive observations of our cosmos. For that reason, I would allow all attempts to explain it, regardless of whether they be mere conjecture or just flat-out pseudo-science. Don't jump on the creative thinkers, be they right or wrong. Remember, we just don't know. Yet.

Just remember Ocham's Razor. The simplest explanation will be the right one. To my mind, DM is probably just a combination of the displacement of the big picture of what is out there through refraction of light through space by gravitic lensing and the presence of the inert element Helium, which is not reactive to light and which comprises about a quarter of the mass of the Universe. Too simple? Sorry. That's life.


Dec 15, 2014
I sure wish phys.org had a method of permitting users to block other users they don't wish to see in comments. I'd enjoy having a conversation with people seriously interested in science on this site, but wading through the junk comments of trolls, science illiterates and fringe nutcases is just too damn time-consuming.


There is a "Ignore User" function under every comment on the right,side, just above the line separating the comments.

Vietvet,
Yeah, but.... Aren't we all really just here to be entertained...:-)?

Dec 15, 2014
I am particularly fond of Dr Paul Marmet's theory of hydrogen. I am also fond of Miles Mathis' recycling of energy taken in at the poles and emitted from the equator.


Aren't you the Skippette who is also fond of the Oliver-The-Molester-Manuel-Skippy too? He's the couyon that had that "The-Sun-Is-A-Magnet-Inside-Of-A Neutron-Star-That-Is-Inside-A-Bigger-Iron-Ball-With-A-Smidgen-Of-Electric-Plasma-Covering-It-Theory".

Dec 15, 2014
The evolution is still just a theory
really ZEPHIR?
surely you could have come back with a better argument than THAT... you should know what a scientific Theory is by now, anyway
it is also a BAD example, as Evolution Theory has a great deal of scientific evidence which is observed AND experiments that are repeated, proving the strength of the Theory, from Lenski et. al. to Extavour et. al.

Aren't we all really just here to be entertained.
@Whydening Gyre
not really
some are here to learn
so why sift through the BS and learn pseudoscience while trying to get to the real stuff?

@Uncle Ira
Contact me at: http://saposjoint.net/ or at http://www.sciforums.com/
so i can give you my e-mail address

i need your translations ability because google translate has my french reply all blocky and confusing!
THANKS

Dec 16, 2014
wow, ya'll peoples is really like smart.

Dec 17, 2014
Reading articles like these about scientists searching for Dark Matter, I am reminded of the story of the 13th century Sufi master, Mullah Nasruddin searching for his keys under a street lamp.
When a friend asked him if he was sure he lost it there, the Mullah replied, "No, I lost it near my house."
Hearing this the friend asked, "then, why are you searching for it here?"
To which the Mullah replied, "Because the light is much better here!"

Dec 17, 2014
This comment has been removed by a moderator.

Dec 26, 2014
@Benni, here's a simple challenge re your claim

You've so often blurted claim re others NOT able to solve Differential Equation (DE), implying U easily can :-)
Strange Y U provoke & as thermodynamics politely advised U its not as easy as U imagine..!

So Benni, here's a simple challenge for U & Water_Prophet who claimed to graduated as a Physical Chemist (PC) :-)

1. Total Solar Insolation (TSI) has more short wave (SW) energy than long wave (LW) radiance
https://en.wikipe...m_en.svg

2. Earth converts SW to LW (SW emission is negligible)
3. LW to space interfered with by absorption/re-radiation of GHG (esp CO2)
http://www.chem.a.../sim/gh/

Here Benni, re your claim on DEs, offer an estimate of LW radiation resistivity due to CO2 & for Water_Prophet suggest Y it's so much more than the thermal energy contributed by burning fossil fuels ~230,000Litres petrol/sec (0.1% of TSI) ?

Or google scholar ;-)

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