Astronomers see distant eruption as black hole destroys star

June 14, 2018, National Radio Astronomy Observatory
Artist conception of a tidal disruption event (TDE) that happens when a star passes fatally close to a supermassive black hole, which reacts by launching a relativistic jet. Credit: Sophia Dagnello, NRAO/AUI/NSF

For the first time, astronomers have directly imaged the formation and expansion of a fast-moving jet of material ejected when the powerful gravity of a supermassive black hole ripped apart a star that wandered too close to the cosmic monster.

The scientists tracked the event with radio and infrared telescopes, including the National Science Foundation's Very Long Baseline Array (VLBA), in a pair of colliding galaxies called Arp 299, nearly 150 million light-years from Earth. At the core of one of the galaxies, a black hole 20 million times more massive than the Sun shredded a star more than twice the Sun's mass, setting off a chain of events that revealed important details of the violent encounter.

Only a small number of such stellar deaths, called tidal disruption events, or TDEs, have been detected, although scientists have hypothesized that they may be a more common occurrence. Theorists suggested that material pulled from the doomed star forms a rotating disk around the black hole, emitting intense X-rays and , and also launches jets of material outward from the poles of the disk at nearly the speed of light.

"Never before have we been able to directly observe the formation and evolution of a jet from one of these events," said Miguel Perez-Torres, of the Astrophysical Institute of Andalusia in Granada, Spain.

The first indication came on January 30, 2005, when astronomers using the William Herschel Telescope in the Canary Islands discovered a bright burst of infrared emission coming from the nucleus of one of the colliding galaxies in Arp 299. On July 17, 2005, the VLBA revealed a new, distinct source of radio emission from the same location.

"As time passed, the new object stayed bright at infrared and radio wavelengths, but not in visible light and X-rays," said Seppo Mattila, of the University of Turku in Finland. "The most likely explanation is that thick interstellar gas and dust near the galaxy's center absorbed the X-rays and visible light, then re-radiated it as infrared," he added. The researchers used the Nordic Optical Telescope on the Canary Islands and NASA's Spitzer space telescope to follow the object's infrared emission.

Continued observations with the VLBA, the European VLBI Network (EVN), and other , carried out over nearly a decade, showed the source of expanding in one direction, just as expected for a jet. The measured expansion indicated that the material in the jet moved at an average of one-fourth the speed of light. Fortunately, the radio waves are not absorbed in the core of the galaxy, but find their way through it to reach the Earth.

Artist conception of a tidal disruption event (TDE) that happens when a star passes fatally close to a supermassive black hole, which reacts by launching a relativistic jet. It zooms out of the central region of its host galaxy, Arp299B, which is undergoing a merging process with Arp299A (the galaxy to the left). Credit: Sophia Dagnello, NRAO/AUI/NSF; NASA, STScI

These observations used multiple radio-telescope antennas, separated by thousands of miles, to gain the resolving power, or ability to see fine detail, required to detect the expansion of an object so distant. The patient, years-long data collection rewarded the scientists with the evidence of a jet.

Most galaxies have supermassive , containing millions to billions of times the mass of the Sun, at their cores. In a black hole, the mass is so concentrated that its gravitational pull is so strong that not even light can escape. When those supermassive black holes are actively drawing in material from their surroundings, that material forms a rotating disk around the black hole, and superfast jets of particles are launched outward. This is the phenomenon seen in radio galaxies and quasars.

"Much of the time, however, supermassive black holes are not actively devouring anything, so they are in a quiet state," Perez-Torres explained. "Tidal disruption events can provide us with a unique opportunity to advance our understanding of the formation and evolution of jets in the vicinities of these powerful objects," he added.

"Because of the dust that absorbed any visible light, this particular tidal disruption event may be just the tip of the iceberg of what until now has been a hidden population," Mattila said. "By looking for these events with infrared and radio telescopes, we may be able to discover many more, and learn from them," he said.

Such events may have been more common in the distant Universe, so studying them may help scientists understand the environment in which galaxies developed billions of years ago.

The discovery, the scientists said, came as a surprise. The initial infrared burst was discovered as part of a project that sought to detect supernova explosions in such colliding pairs of galaxies. Arp 299 has seen numerous stellar explosions, and has been dubbed a "supernova factory." This new object originally was considered to be a supernova explosion. Only in 2011, six years after discovery, the radio-emitting portion began to show an elongation. Subsequent monitoring showed the expansion growing, confirming that what the scientists are seeing is a jet, not a supernova.

Mattila and Perez-Torres led a team of 36 scientists from 26 institutions around the world in the observations of Arp 299. They published their findings in the 14 June online issue of the journal Science.

Explore further: VLA reveals 'bashful' black hole in neighboring galaxy

More information: S. Mattila el al., "A dust-enshrouded tidal disruption event with a resolved radio jet in a galaxy merger," Science (2018). science.sciencemag.org/lookup/ … 1126/science.aao4669

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Gatun
2 / 5 (4) Jun 15, 2018
What powers light to reach the speed of light? And if blackholes prevent light from escaping does that mean gravity is more powerful than what powers light?
Ojorf
3.3 / 5 (7) Jun 15, 2018
What powers light to reach the speed of light? And if blackholes prevent light from escaping does that mean gravity is more powerful than what powers light?


Nothing powers light.

The speed of light is a property of massless particles, understood by virtue of Special Relativity, they MUST always travel at his speed.

Just google "massless particle".
granville583762
2.7 / 5 (7) Jun 15, 2018
The answers raise more interesting questions than your question!
What powers light to reach the speed of light? And if blackholes prevent light from escaping does that
mean gravity is more powerful than what powers light?

Very interesting questions where the answers that abound to these questions lead to as many questions to the answers that leads to nullifying the answers to the original questions because light being massless is attracted by gravity which can only attract mass is the first nullification and gravity travels at the speed of light so how do you catch your photons with a graviton travelling at the same speed nullifies the next question - this is like runners trying to catch the runner with baton while both running at the same speed!
granville583762
3 / 5 (8) Jun 15, 2018
The power of commenting
Ojorf> Nothing powers light.
The speed of light is a property of massless particles, understood by virtue of Special Relativity, they MUST always travel at his speed.
Just google "massless particle".

The answers to these questions are not exactly in Wikipedia which is why Gatun poised these questions. The answer to these question comes with experience which you also like Gatun have not answered the questions because you have deferred to the internet, I also cannot answer these questions but I have tried which is why were here Ojorf, because if everyone looked on Google no one would need to comment on phys.org.
434a
3.2 / 5 (9) Jun 15, 2018

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LariAnn
3.4 / 5 (5) Jun 15, 2018
BTW, where is the "direct image" of this event? Artist conception only?
the red pill
3 / 5 (2) Jun 15, 2018
I see the same thing every time I eat at one of those cheap Mexican places.
Ojorf
3.3 / 5 (7) Jun 15, 2018
The answers to these questions are not exactly in Wikipedia which is why Gatun poised these questions. The answer to these question comes with experience which you also like Gatun have not answered the questions because you have deferred to the internet...


But the answers are EXACTLY in Wikipedia, you did not look, try "Maxwell's equations".

I also cannot answer these questions but I have tried which is why were here Ojorf, because if everyone looked on Google no one would need to comment on phys.org.


Can't give you any points for trying to answer a question you don't have a clue about. In fact its pretty stupid if the answer is so easy to find on Wikipedia.
rrwillsj
2.3 / 5 (3) Jun 15, 2018
people want 2+2 = 22.
want it
wish for it
pray for it

any answer but 2+2 = 4 is wrong. Always 4. Always will be.

The truly interesting question is why you waste what intellectual capacity you have available on desperately floundering about trying to prove a wrong answer?

How about an empirical experiment? You jumping off a cliff to prove that the Theory of Gravity has to be wrong. You remember reading that assertion in a comicbook. Or saw a utube video that claimed to display a TOP SECRET antigravity device floating.

Let us know how that turns out for you.
rossim22
not rated yet Jun 15, 2018
What powers light to reach the speed of light?


What powers an electron to rotate around a nucleus but prevents them from ever touching?
Phil Haberkorn in Indiana
2.1 / 5 (7) Jun 15, 2018
What powers a fart to travel at the speed of smell? I'm just looking for an explanation, no pictures are necessary.....
Tuxford
1.9 / 5 (13) Jun 15, 2018
What powers light to reach the speed of light?


What powers an electron to rotate around a nucleus but prevents them from ever touching?

Exactly the problem with modern physics. What is the physical mechanism that causes the actions that are interpreted as forces and fields. The latter are just simplifying assumptions: a math model. What is the mechanism? Sub-Quantum Kinectics by LaViolette provides an answer. Anybody else?
jimmybobber
4.4 / 5 (7) Jun 15, 2018
Sub-Quantum Kinetics: "Instead of beginning with physical observations..." from http://starburstf...summary/

You can't be serious.
TrollBane
4.3 / 5 (6) Jun 15, 2018
'BTW, where is the "direct image" of this event? Artist conception only?' Perhaps that was the only thing released because the observation, while 'direct', was only made in infrared and radio wavelengths. "The scientists tracked the event with radio and infrared telescopes..."
jimmybobber
4.6 / 5 (10) Jun 15, 2018
@LariAnn: It's unfortunate that this particular article doesn't link the direct images. Here is a link that does. http://www.skyand...ots-jet/
TrollBane
4.4 / 5 (7) Jun 15, 2018
Thanks for the link, JB.
Da Schneib
4 / 5 (4) Jun 16, 2018
Good stuff, @jimmy.
granville583762
3.7 / 5 (3) Jun 16, 2018
What powers light to reach the speed of light?
Ojorf> Can't give you any points for trying to answer a question you don't have a clue about. In fact its pretty stupid if the answer is so easy to find on Wikipedia.

But the answer to "What powers light to reach the speed of light" is not on Wikipedia, explanations to physical realities do not exist in formula Ojorf, they exist in written text which comes with experience.
The written non mathematical answer is still forth coming because this is part of Gatun question.
granville583762
3.7 / 5 (3) Jun 16, 2018
The amount of written text so far on "What powers light to reach the speed of light" if instead it had been put into given a written explanation to Gatun's question, we would be all sitting smugly with pride, instead we are squabbling over Wikipedia and the answer is still forth coming.
This is like saying Ojorf - I don't know the answer, just go and look on Wikipedia!
jimmybobber
4.4 / 5 (7) Jun 16, 2018
Nothing "powers" electromagnetic radiation to the speed of light.
Electromagnetic radiation does not start at rest and then accelerate to the speed of light. It always travels at a constant speed depending on the medium it's traveling through.

Electromagnetic radiation has a rest mass of zero (however it's never at rest) and carries energy from it's momentum. Particles with zero rest mass travel at the speed of light according to the observation and theory. Sometimes we just have to accept that some things are true without explanation.

Again. Nothing powers light to light speed.
billpress11
1 / 5 (2) Jun 16, 2018
Electromagnetic radiation is considered to have no rest mass but in a way one can say it does. An electron and a positron can turn their mass into gamma rays which are considered to have no mass but gamma rays under the right conditions can also recreate an electron and a positron again, which in a way could be considered a gamma rays rest mass. So mass turned into energy is what powers electromagnetic radiation.
Da Schneib
4 / 5 (4) Jun 16, 2018
@billpress, mass and energy are equivalent. There isn't any "turn into." The difference between them is that massful particles interact with the Higgs boson and energyful particles don't. What changes when particle-antiparticle pairs annihilate is that all their charges cancel out, except the mass charge. Then the Higgs interaction doesn't happen anymore, and all that's left is energy.
Ojorf
3 / 5 (6) Jun 17, 2018
The amount of written text so far on "What powers light to reach the speed of light" if instead it had been put into given a written explanation to Gatun's question, we would be all sitting smugly with pride, instead we are squabbling over Wikipedia and the answer is still forth coming.
This is like saying Ojorf - I don't know the answer, just go and look on Wikipedia!

You don't read/follow very well do you?
You could as well ask what powers spin? Nothing it is a property of particles.
What powers mass? Nothing it is a property of particles.
What powers a massless particle to travel at C, nothing it is a property of massless particles.

Why a massless particle HAS to travel at C is perfectly explained on Wikipedia.
What do you still not understand?
humy
5 / 5 (7) Jun 17, 2018
Sub-Quantum Kinetics: "Instead of beginning with physical observations..." from http://starburstf...summary/

You can't be serious.

I have never heard of this one before so I read your link.
I am afraid the stupid "Instead of beginning with physical observations..." part is just the start because it then goes on to promote the now long-since scientifically debunked very old ether theory.
Its all total pseudo scientific crap. It actually promotes anti-scientific methods for creating models and clearly rejects the sound scientific methods normally used.
Unbelievable.
Da Schneib
3.7 / 5 (6) Jun 17, 2018
Since I'm bored I suppose it's worth writing about where the mass in nuclei comes from, especially since most of the bright mass in the universe comes from the nuclei of atoms.

The mass of a proton, the simplest nucleon, isn't in the quarks. All together the three quarks in a proton only mass as much as a handful of electrons. So how come a proton masses as much as 1836 electrons?

The answer is, most of the mass in a proton is energy. It's the binding energy of the color force that holds the quarks together. Energy has mass; we know this from relativity. We know that a stretched rubber band has more mass than a limp one; you can find this googling around if you like. Well, the force that holds the rubber band together is electrostatic, and when it's stretched, the inter-molecular bonds in the rubber are stressed, and that equals energy. This is why the right hand side of the Einstein equations has the stress-energy tensor in it.
[contd]
Da Schneib
3.7 / 5 (6) Jun 17, 2018
[contd]
In the same way, the tension of the color force among the quarks in the proton has a lot of energy in it, a great deal more than the electromagnetic force among the quarks; this energy is the most important part of the proton, over 1500 electron masses of it. The electromagnetic force among the quarks is second most, and in fact the mass of the quarks is just about the least (except for a small weak force component which we can calculate but doesn't make much difference, and a very small gravity component which we don't know how to calculate because we don't have a quantum field theory of gravitation yet).

All these things are also true of neutrons; the only difference is, there's a small mass difference between the neutron and proton, both because of the electromagnetism (the proton has a charge and the neutron does not) and because of the mass difference between an up and a down quark (a proton is two ups and a down, a neutron is two downs and an up).
[contd]
Da Schneib
3.7 / 5 (6) Jun 17, 2018
[contd]
The color force binding energy is about the same between a neutron and proton, so most of the mass difference is the quarks and the electromagnetic force. Down quarks are a bit heavier than up quarks.

Now, free protons are stable and free neutrons are not. This is because even though it's a very small difference, it's enough to allow an energy difference between them, so a neutron can decay into a proton. But it's very small, so the lifetime of a free neutron is very long on quantum scales; almost 15 minutes mean lifetime. This is on the close order of 900 billion nanoseconds, and even a nanosecond is a long time in the quantum world. What really happens of course is that one of the downs in the neutron decays into an up.

But when a neutron is in a nucleus, the picture is very different. Because the neutrons and protons in the nucleus interact by the color force, and can exchange quarks, the neutrons are stabilized, as long as there aren't too many of them.
[contd]
Da Schneib
3.7 / 5 (6) Jun 17, 2018
[contd]
So now we see that the mass in a nucleus is not only controlled by the color force within the neutrons and protons, but also by the color force among them. And most of the mass of a nucleus comes from this. And most of the mass of an atom comes from the nucleus.

Let me state this another way: most of the mass of the visible, bright matter in the universe is color force binding energy. So it's not so surprising that something we can't even see, dark matter, is a thing. After all, most of what we think of as "mass" is energy in the first place.

Don't be so quick to dismiss dark matter. Everything you see or touch, pretty much, is mostly energy anyway. There's only a minor contamination of electrons and up and down quarks in it.
milnik
1 / 5 (2) Jun 17, 2018
If you want to find out the initial cause of any phenomenon in the universe, you must understand and accept the truth, that in the universe must exist the substance from which matter is formed. If you understand this, the next step is that you must accept that matter is formed by the law that someone in the universe has established. And we, human beings are thus created, and it is illusory to try to ask the answer: who is the one who gave the laws and so on. It is enough to know: what is matter, how it originates and what it forms, and then understand that matter must have a "family relationship" with the substance from which it forms, thereby causing gravity and magnetism.
Gravity does not bend light, magnetism takes place. If they do not know this, scientists do not know anything.
Surveillance_Egg_Unit
3.4 / 5 (5) Jun 17, 2018
The NRAO page contains the animated gif of the images from 2012 to 2015

https://public.nr...ys-star/
granville583762
4 / 5 (4) Jun 17, 2018
The amount of written text "What powers light to reach the speed of light".
like saying Ojorf - I don't know the answer, just go and look on Wikipedia!

Ojorf> You don't read/follow very well do you?
You could as well ask what powers spin? Nothing it is a property of particles.
What powers mass? Nothing it is a property of particles.
What powers a massless particle to travel at C, nothing it is a property of massless particles.

I repeat "The amount of written text so far on "What powers light to reach the speed of light" if instead it had been put into given a written explanation to Gatun's question"
You have just further replied with further written text and the answer is still forth coming Ojorf. The ANSWER is not NOTHING Ojorf, only massless particles travel at C Ojorf, but that is not the answer. Why do massless particles travel at C and it is not because infinite KINETIC-energy is required for mass to travel at C as this is still deferring the question
granville583762
3.4 / 5 (5) Jun 17, 2018
The Gatun Question and the forth coming answer
Ojorf, by myself bring aspects of relativism - infinite kinetic energy and not saying the answer is "nothing powers light to C" it just does and there's an end to it as your good self appears to be saying Ojorf.
I appear to be accomplishing a better task at answering the question than your good self where my instincts tell me your good self can answer the Gatun Question to everyone's satisfaction because you are starting to by introducing aspects of the of the atomic processes where lights velocity is dependant
You are answering the Gatun question through my relentless approach that I have on these matters Ojorf
One of my few philosophies is "Nothing", "No" and plain old "I just do not know" are not in my vocabulary Ojorf.
granville583762
3.4 / 5 (5) Jun 17, 2018
The Gatun Question, the written text so far and the forth coming answer
And still no answer
Because if the answer were to be found on Wikipedia Ojorf, with all this written text so far which is padding out my treatise on this matter, it would have fitted in neatly between your sentences Ojorf.
Ojorf
3.9 / 5 (11) Jun 17, 2018
Gee granny, you missed the bit about "Maxwell's equations".

He already calculated the value of C around 1862.

Here it is explained very simply: https://courses.l...bserved/

Do you now understand?
granville583762
3.4 / 5 (5) Jun 17, 2018
Magnetisation and electric-constant velocities are the speed of light, where as the combination to electromagnetic-radiation its velocity is light, were dealing with three entities electric, magnetic and electromagnetic radiation which their roots can be traced back to the electric field so we have moved no further on as to Gatuns question as to what powers light to the speed of light
The electric field travels at light speed were going in circles - to come out this feedback loop what causes the electric field to travel at its velocity as it is the common denominator in calculating the speed of light but which does not explain why electric fields travel at the speed of light in the first instance Ojorf.
granville583762
3 / 5 (6) Jun 17, 2018
Faith in your constants
This is the kibble balance philosophy where the kilogram becomes a constant related to 299792458m/s where the speed of light is not precisely to 299792458m/s but to decimal points, which begs the question how accurate is your kilogram Ojorf, it is not precise because no amount of faith will make anybody believe the speed of light is exactly precisely 299792458m/s!
granville583762
2.7 / 5 (7) Jun 17, 2018
Getting lost in constants of mathematical constructs in the kibbe balance

And to make matters worse Ojorf, the metre becomes 1/299792458 and the second becomes 299792458metres
jimmybobber
4.2 / 5 (10) Jun 17, 2018
@Granville: Nobody has "faith" in our constants. You do realize that if the speed of light was not constant then Maxwell's Equations would not hold true in every inertial reference frame, therefore the laws of physics for electromagnetism in every reference frame would not be equivalent. The universe would not exist as we know it. This is most definitely not a matter of "faith."
granville583762
3.3 / 5 (7) Jun 17, 2018
jimmybobber> @Granville: Nobody has "faith" in our constants. You do realize that if the speed of light was not constant then Maxwell's Equations would not hold true in every inertial reference frame, therefore the laws of physics for electromagnetism in every reference frame would not be equivalent. The universe would not exist as we know it. This is most definitely not a matter of "faith."

jimmybobber:- If you read again I did not say C was not constant but not exactly 299792458m/s but to decimal points as whatever its correct value that is the constant!
Where faith comes into it jimmybobber, is believing it is exactly 299792458m/s to the last mm/s and that is what I said jimmybobber – it is patently not correct to the last mm/s
jimmybobber
4.1 / 5 (9) Jun 17, 2018
@Granville: actually it is exactly that.
From your friend wikipedia https://en.wikipe...of_light
"The speed of light in vacuum, commonly denoted c, is a universal physical constant important in many areas of physics. Its exact value is 299,792,458 metres per second (approximately 300,000 km/s (186,000 mi/s)[Note 3]). It is exact because by international agreement a metre is defined to be the length of the path travelled by light in vacuum during a time interval of 1/299792458 second."
granville583762
3 / 5 (6) Jun 17, 2018
@Granville: actually it is exactly that.
From your friend wikipedia https://en.wikipe...of_light
"The speed of light in vacuum, commonly denoted c, is a universal physical constant important in many areas of physics. Its exact value is 299,792,458 metres per second (approximately 300,000 km/s (186,000 mi/s)[Note 3]). It is exact because by international agreement a metre is defined to be the length of the path travelled by light in vacuum during a time interval of 1/299792458 second."

jimmybobber it has to be internationally agreed and that value adhered, to but it does not change the fact this value is not correct to the mm/s
granville583762
2.7 / 5 (7) Jun 17, 2018
jimmybobber:- This value is like Pluto was internationally agreed a planet, is now internationally agreed a dwarf-planet .
The internationally agreed speed of light Is not fixed, and when a more accurate figure is obtained, it will be internationally agreed.
granville583762
3 / 5 (4) Jun 17, 2018
Blackhole spin-axis jets
phys.org> At the core of one of the galaxies, a black hole 20 million times more massive than the Sun shredded a star more than twice the Sun's mass, setting off a chain of events that revealed important details of the violent encounter

At 20million to 1 is difficult to tell the definition of stellar sized star shredded or instant disintegration
The jet is what is ejected from the blackhole spin-axis into their star forming Fermi bubbles above and below the galaxy stretching over 23 thousand light years where blackholes eject 50% of the mass they take in through their spin-axis.
The infra-red burst makes detection easier and more common place
ZoeBell
Jun 18, 2018
This comment has been removed by a moderator.
savvys84
1 / 5 (5) Jun 18, 2018
Important discovery. So how far from the black hole the gas will orbit? Anyone
Btw black holes are black because the electromagnetic wave cannot propagate

https://www.scrib...savvys84
antialias_physorg
5 / 5 (6) Jun 18, 2018
Btw black holes are black because the electromagnetic wave cannot propagate

This is patently wrong. I think you need to look up a lot of basic physics before making such ludicrous pronouncements.
(oh, and BTW...posting images of rotten fruit as proof against time dilation isn't exactly going to give you a lot of cred in the science community)
savvys84
1 / 5 (4) Jun 19, 2018
Btw black holes are black because the electromagnetic wave cannot propagate

This is patently wrong. I think you need to look up a lot of basic physics before making such ludicrous pronouncements.
(oh, and BTW...posting images of rotten fruit as proof against time dilation isn't exactly going to give you a lot of cred in the science community)

Lol post something original, will ya
Ojorf
3.9 / 5 (7) Jun 19, 2018
Lol, once facts have been established they are not original anymore.
Post something factual won't ya.
jonesdave
3.7 / 5 (6) Jun 19, 2018
Btw black holes are black because the electromagnetic wave cannot propagate

This is patently wrong. I think you need to look up a lot of basic physics before making such ludicrous pronouncements.
(oh, and BTW...posting images of rotten fruit as proof against time dilation isn't exactly going to give you a lot of cred in the science community)

Lol post something original, will ya


Oh dear. Another 'Einstein was wrong' crank. The world of crackpottery is full of them.
humy
4.4 / 5 (7) Jun 19, 2018
If you want to find out the initial cause of any phenomenon in the universe, you must understand and accept the truth, that in the universe must exist the substance from which matter is formed. If you understand this, the next step is that you must accept that matter is formed by the law that someone in the universe has established. And we, human beings are thus created, and it is illusory to try to ask the answer: who is the one who gave the laws and so on. It is enough to know: what is matter, how it originates and what it forms, and then understand that matter must have a "family relationship" with the substance from which it forms, thereby causing gravity and magnetism.
Gravity does not bend light, magnetism takes place. If they do not know this, scientists do not know anything.


milnik

Seriously, is all this above a joke? That is a genuine question.
granville583762
3.4 / 5 (5) Jun 19, 2018
Philosophy and mission in life
milnik> If you want to find out the initial cause of any phenomenon in the universe.... and then understand that matter must have a "family relationship" with the substance from which it forms, thereby causing gravity and magnetism…Gravity does not bend light, magnetism takes place. If they do not know this, scientists do not know anything

humy> milnik Seriously, is all this above a joke? That is a genuine question.

You fell for it humy, milnic has a philosophy and a mission in life and this implies humy a requisite theory of the universe and how it exists and interacts which does not necessarily have to be true as long as it has some grains of truth to give that credibility it needs humy
As you have already gathered humy, consequently milnics theory cannot be questioned as it is questoning the Divine Creator which you can not question humy
Look back at all the interactive texting with milnic you will to this conclusion
milnik
1 / 5 (3) Jun 19, 2018
@humy,
I never made a joke, if it is discussed about the phenomena that human beings formed us as well. This is the truth that we must respect. Those who think that they can "produce" many and false proofs of theories, are not human beings, because they do not respect or understand the one who formed them.
  @ granville,
I do not understand what you want to say about my statements and discussions. Use your awareness and then it will be clear what you want to say. But if you are dealing with stupid and wrong other people's theories, you will never understand the structure of the universe, which is much simpler than imagined by people without consciousness and respect for the SEU.
Ojorf
3.3 / 5 (7) Jun 19, 2018
@humy,
I never made a joke


So you were not joking when the other day you wrote:

"Dark matter" is a "product" of thoughts, of those people whose consciousness is erased, and consciousness is the power of knowing the true causes of the phenomenon, in general.


Made me smile.
milnik
1 / 5 (3) Jun 19, 2018
@Ojorf,
What you say is that I said, there is no room, it's true, because stupid are all scientists who think there is dark matter. There is only an existing, visible and measurable material. What you think is dark matter, it's Aether that completes the infinite universe. If you want to discuss such strangers, first, you need to know what is the matter, how it is formed and what it forms. Who does not understand this, but wants to find out something at a higher level of behavior, it is a completely stupid man.
granville583762
3.7 / 5 (3) Jun 19, 2018
Questioning the Divine Creator
@humy, I never made a joke….they do not respect or understand the one who formed them.
@ granville, I do not understand what you want to say about my statements and discussions…. you will never understand the structure of the universe, which is much simpler than imagined by people without consciousness and respect for the SEU

granville583762> As you have already gathered humy, consequently milnics theory cannot be questioned as it is questioning the Divine Creator which you cannot question humy. Look back at all the interactive texting with milnic you will to this conclusion

Said it in One milnic
Questioning SEU the spiritual entity of Universe, is questioning the Divine Creator which you also cannot question milnic
granville583762
3.7 / 5 (3) Jun 19, 2018
SEU and the Divine Creator
We have had long discussions on this point of the spiritual entity of the universe milnic, and short of repeating the worn out arguments on the interpretations as to the existence of SEU, there is not one atom of difference to separate SEU from the Divine Creator milnic.
We all know what the divine creator is milnic, it is GOD!
Ojorf
3.3 / 5 (7) Jun 20, 2018
Cuckoo....
savvys84
1 / 5 (3) Jun 20, 2018
Lol, once facts have been established they are not original anymore.
Post something factual won't ya.

what facts are you on about. go ahd and read and understand all my papers
antialias_physorg
4.5 / 5 (8) Jun 20, 2018
what facts are you on about. go ahd and read and understand all my papers

Really guys, you should. You have never seen such concentrated crazy, I promise you. Manifests written in crayon are works of absolute genius in comparison.
It's a whole education in how self deluded one individual can be.
434a
5 / 5 (7) Jun 20, 2018
It's a whole education in how self deluded one individual can be.


Q1. Do you have an interest in Physics. Yes/No - If Yes go to Q2

Q2. Do you have any formal education in physics or maths beyond high school Yes/No - If No go to Q3 if Yes - You're fine, feel free to finish here.

Q3. Was Einstein a crank in your opinion Yes/No - If Yes - Congratulations you're delusional go to Q4. If No feel free to finish here.

Q4. Is the sun a giant light bulb? Yes/No - If yes - Go to question 5. If No, it's not to late, get an education, you might be fine in a year or so.

Q5. Have you written an unpublished theory of everything, that no-one is allowed to read except you and your invisible friend Larry. Yes/No - If Yes - Well done you are a complete loon, try commenting on Physorg you'll love it. Bring along Larry, he can meet all the other invisible friends.
milnik
1 / 5 (2) Jun 20, 2018
@granville,
do not play a clown with some kind of blend of ordinary and quasi-philosophical expressions. You're probably aware that you are not a descendant of a big bang. God is not what many religions preach, because they do not have a scientific basis for understanding natural laws, and also science is not on the right path to knowing natural laws, because it does not respect the existence of the SEU, nor does it know anything from it, and therefore walks through unknown appear in the universe and calls them "dark" Why "Because science has made a false" Creator "from the theory of all phenomena that it does not understand at all. Analyze the processes by which you are formed and if you succeed, then you have a chance to find out what Today, both you and science are prattle and bleat !!.
granville583762
3.7 / 5 (3) Jun 20, 2018
Your theories are falling flat milnic and there is no room in the inn
milnic> @granville,
do not play a clown with some kind of blend of ordinary and quasi-philosophical expressions. ... you and science are prattle and bleat !!.

There you milnic! "We have had long discussions on this point of the spiritual entity of the universe milnic, and short of repeating the worn out arguments on the interpretations as to the existence of SEU"
We are going over the the same worn out arguments yet again milnic!
I do not believe in theories as they come back and bite you when your theories fall flat.
Consequently I do not have any theories and for the fore see able future the status quo is not changing, so there is no room in the inn. milnic!
granville583762
3.7 / 5 (3) Jun 20, 2018
In the final analysis dust to dust, ash's to ash's to the earth you return
One day when the grim reaper leaves his calling card as he does to every living being in the vacuum of space, you are going to be sorely disappointed milnic and the irony milnic, is the very reason you're going to be sorely disappointed is the very reason its self milnic.
You will never know.
When our four scour years and ten reach their ultimatum milnic, as dust to, dust ash's to ash's to the earth you return that is literally it, milnic, no more, no less.
Ojorf
2 / 5 (4) Jun 20, 2018
Who is ash?
rrwillsj
1 / 5 (2) Jun 20, 2018
All these comments are proof of my Theory of Stupid Design and the futility of big brains as a deadend of evolution. Since these commentators are displaying a decided lack of intellectual competency,
barakn
2 / 5 (4) Jun 20, 2018
Who is ash?

And what does he possess?
granville583762
3.7 / 5 (3) Jun 20, 2018
Theory of Stupid Design and its application
rrwillis> All these comments are proof of my Theory of Stupid Design and the futility of big brains as a deadend of evolution. Since these commentators are displaying a decided lack of intellectual competency,

It beats expletives hands down any day rrwillis.
Shall we start applying your Theory of Stupid Design that that shows expletive discussion with its accompanying 5stars, compared to these intellectual discussions that milnic has on SEU
Unless you like the 5stars obtained by expletives versus the 1star obtained by milnic on SEU?
.
granville583762
5 / 5 (1) Jun 20, 2018
Theory of Stupid Design and its application
Orjorf> Who is ash?

barakn> And what does he possess?

Is this Mr Ash, Mrs Ash or Miss Ash or an Ash Tree,
If we apply rrwillis's Theory of Stupid Design, is it in actuality a misspelling of ashes - dust to dust, ashes to ashes to the earth you return -
Misspelling of words is mentally corrected in the context in their use
I suddenly have great interest in rrwillis's Theory of Stupid Design and its multiplicity of use in its application.
barakn
1 / 5 (4) Jun 20, 2018
@billpress, mass and energy are equivalent. There isn't any "turn into." The difference between them is that massful particles interact with the Higgs boson and energyful particles don't. What changes when particle-antiparticle pairs annihilate is that all their charges cancel out, except the mass charge. Then the Higgs interaction doesn't happen anymore, and all that's left is energy. -Da Schneib
That's just playing games with semantics. In a Feynman diagram of electron-positron annihilation, two particle paths, one labeled positron and another labeled electron, approach, and then two paths both labeled gamma diverge. If billpress wants to call that label change "turn into," that's a perfectly normal usage of the English language. It's far closer to a genuine "turning into" than when a magician puts an egg into a hat and pulls out a rabbit.
savvys84
1 / 5 (2) Jun 21, 2018
what facts are you on about. go ahd and read and understand all my papers

Really guys, you should. You have never seen such concentrated crazy, I promise you. Manifests written in crayon are works of absolute genius in comparison.
It's a whole education in how self deluded one individual can be.

List all the flaws in those papers and post here and I will clarify all your doubts. Game?
antialias_physorg
5 / 5 (2) Jun 21, 2018
Game?

All of it. Seriously. Every single sentence is wrong in them.

And no. I'm not about to go back and having a second look. The amount of crazy in them is just not worth my time. A professional psychoanalyst (and someone to be put in charge of your life) is what you need.
granville583762
5 / 5 (2) Jun 21, 2018
434a> Ayup chatbot owners.
I understan' 'a' i' thy desire ta 'ide t' deficiencies i' thy artifical intelligence theur gev it eur cova story 'a' it belongs eur region o' englan' known for its accen'tli'.
An' ah can alsoa understan' why theur chose Yorksha, Yorksha fowk, whoa are actually lush, can be reeight confusin a' times.
Howeva, trust uz when assez this; even t' gran' fowk o' t' ridings are not capable o' t' level o' 'orse apples 'a' theur can read aboon.
It's tahhm ta start agin, for everyone's sake.
Please, we beg theur, tek pity on wee.
I'd ratha spen' eur day i' lanacasta then read anymooar o' dis knackers.

Well done 434a this beats expletives hands down any day
savvys84
not rated yet Jun 22, 2018
Game?

All of it. Seriously. Every single sentence is wrong in them.

And no. I'm not about to go back and having a second look. The amount of crazy in them is just not worth my time. A professional psychoanalyst (and someone to be put in charge of your life) is what you need.

Lol you need to see a psychiatrist pronto
savvys84
not rated yet Jun 22, 2018

Ayup chatbot owners.
I understan' 'a' i' thy desire ta 'ide t' deficiencies i' thy artifical intelligence theur gev it eur cova story 'a' it belongs eur region o' englan' known for its accen'tli'.
.

Lol nice one

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