Online rights groups fear violence backlash

Sep 15, 2012 by Glenn Chapman
Sudanese protesters try to break into the US embassy in Khartoum during a protest against an amateur film mocking Islam. Internet rights champions were fearful that free speech online may be among the victims of violence spurred by an anti-Islam video posted to YouTube.

Internet rights champions on Friday were fearful that free speech online may be among the victims of violence spurred by an anti-Islam video posted to YouTube.

A decision by YouTube parent Google to deny access to the in Libya and Egypt even though the film's hateful message isn't aimed at a particular person was seen by some as a compassionate step onto a slippery slope.

"If they do it this once, they are going to do it in other situations," said Eva Galperin, freedom of expression coordinator at the and nopn-profit pressure group.

"There is a good chance you will hear from Google that, just this once, extenuating circumstances made them turn their back on freedom of expression; but that is just the beginning of the slippery slope."

On Friday, Google added India to the list of countries where YouTube has blocked access to the anti-Islam film, which surfaced in the United States and has since sparked deadly protests in the Muslim world.

The Pakistani and Afghan governments have blocked the movie themselves.

Indonesia, where most of the 240 million population practice Islam, has also demanded that Google-owned YouTube remove the film from its website.

Protesters have targeted US embassies over the film, which portrays the Prophet Mohammed as an immoral sexual deviant.

Four people died in the Yemeni capital Sanaa on Thursday as violence flared outside US embassies over the low-budget film.

The deaths followed the killing of a US diplomat and three colleagues in Syria Tuesday, after a mob stormed the consulate in Benghazi.

Galperin branded Google's of the video a "distressing" move that "lets the thugs off the hook" by wrongly shifting responsibility to YouTube.

YouTube said that the video did not violate terms of service so would remain at the video-sharing website but that "given the very difficult situation in Libya and Egypt we have temporarily restricted access in both countries."

"Our hearts are with the families of the people murdered in yesterday's attack in Libya," the YouTube spokesman said.

The White House said Friday it nudged YouTube to consider removing the film.

National Security Council spokesman Tommy Vietor said officials "reached out to YouTube to call the video to their attention and ask them to review whether it violates their terms of use."

Extracts of the film were still available on YouTube on Friday, though were accompanied by a warning that the content was "potentially offensive or inappropriate," adding that viewer discretion was advised.

White House spokesman Jay Carney described the spreading demonstrations and attacks on US diplomatic posts in the Arab world sparked by the video as "a fairly volatile situation."

has made a point of not mediating content, opting to provide tools for copyright owners, governments and others to submit "take-down" notices for online content that is pirated, illegal, or in violation of service terms.

"That is one of the reasons YouTube has become this tremendous platform for expression all over the world," Galperin said.

"If decides who can handle a video and who can't, that is extraordinarily paternalistic."

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ackack
1.4 / 5 (5) Sep 15, 2012
I don't know why YouTube or Google has any say in these issues. Once a policy decision is made they simply must enforce it in that country. You don't ask a corporation to do something out of the goodness of their heart, you tell them to do it.

There are countries in the world such as Canada where the creator of this movie would be charged with committing a hate crime. Should YouTube become an accessory to this crime by posting a supporting video?

The poor Americans call it "freedom of speech" because they don't understand that one person's freedom to speak will often remove another person's freedom to live without persecution.
ryggesogn2
2.8 / 5 (13) Sep 15, 2012
But Islam is a religion of peace? What is there to fear?
ryggesogn2
2.8 / 5 (13) Sep 15, 2012
Why won't the Australian govt arrest the parents who force their children hold a sign that says "Behead all who insult the prophet"?
Doesn't Australia have 'hate crime' laws or child abuse laws?
https://pbs.twimg...pg:large
Meyer
5 / 5 (8) Sep 15, 2012
What is there to say about a people that can't be trusted to watch a YouTube video without killing people in protest of the video's mere existence? I think people *can* watch offensive videos without flying off the handle. A video, alone, did not cause this reaction.
rfw
4.3 / 5 (6) Sep 15, 2012
Meyer, the people you refer to appear to be both under-educated and hugely over-indoctrinated. If religions can be compared to maps of reality, then these people are willing to kill others for disagreeing over their map-reading skills??? What do I have to say about them? Educate and de-indoctrinate them, thats what.
ryggesogn2
2.5 / 5 (11) Sep 15, 2012
What is there to say about a people that can't be trusted to watch a YouTube video without killing people in protest of the video's mere existence? I think people *can* watch offensive videos without flying off the handle. A video, alone, did not cause this reaction.

Of course they can watch offensive videos.
Too bad we have gutless 'leaders', a media and gullible masses who believe this is the reason.
I noticed Jews and Americans didn't riot when the video showing the murder of Daniel Pearl was posted.
kochevnik
2.7 / 5 (7) Sep 15, 2012
Religion is a disease. As Ghost points out, it is fortunately self-limiting. Unfortunately it leaves behind destroyed ecosystems ass the religionists starve out. People prone to religion shouldn't be granted the privilege of reproduction. Then the world can know peace for the first time.
I noticed Jews and Americans didn't riot when the video showing the murder of Daniel Pearl was posted.
Yes because unlike you they know a CIA operation when they see it. Why don't you mention all the ICTS mossad airport security stories while you're at it? The fluid bombers (discredited_ underwear bomber etc were all ICTS.
John_Dellysse
4.3 / 5 (6) Sep 15, 2012
This story is distracting from the fact that the attacks on the embassy had little to do with this video. Check out msnbc rachel maddow show
VendicarD
3.4 / 5 (5) Sep 15, 2012
If Christianity is a religion of peace then why did Good Christian Timothy McVeigh murder 200 of his fellow Americans when he blew up that government office building in Oklahoma city in 1995.

Why are so many Christian Militia groups on the U.S. terrorist watch list?

"But Islam is a religion of peace?" - RyggTard

Why did a good Christian produce the film who produced the riots of the last few days?

And why did good Christian George Bush decide to murder a million women and children in Afghanistan and Iraq?

http://www.thepro...rder.HTM

Doesn't "God hate Fags?"

http://www.youtub...uW2v6U2o
VendicarD
3.7 / 5 (3) Sep 15, 2012
RyggTard want's action... More middle east murder committed by his nation's military? Or more violation of national rights by his nation's military?

I'm not sure who he feels the target should be.

Perhaps some women and children at a wedding somewhere.

"Too bad we have gutless 'leaders'" - RyggTard
ryggesogn2
2.5 / 5 (11) Sep 15, 2012
Religion is a disease. As Ghost points out, it is fortunately self-limiting. Unfortunately it leaves behind destroyed ecosystems ass the religionists starve out. People prone to religion shouldn't be granted the privilege of reproduction. Then the world can know peace for the first time.
I noticed Jews and Americans didn't riot when the video showing the murder of Daniel Pearl was posted.
Yes because unlike you they know a CIA operation when they see it. Why don't you mention all the ICTS mossad airport security stories while you're at it? The fluid bombers (discredited_ underwear bomber etc were all ICTS.

Trouble is for athesits, unlike Christians and Jews, Muslims will kill them for trying to eradicate the 'disease'.
VendicarD
3.7 / 5 (3) Sep 15, 2012
I also note that they generally supported the murder of a million women and children by their nations military.

Perhaps they should have rioted against the murderous policies of their own leader.

"I noticed Jews and Americans didn't riot when the video showing the murder of Daniel Pearl was posted." - RyggTard

Christian Riots in Nigeria leave many dead

http://news.bbc.c...8726.stm

Egypt's Christians protest against riot deaths

http://www.eurone...-deaths/

http://www.guardi...ld-video
kochevnik
2.1 / 5 (7) Sep 15, 2012
Trouble is for athesits, unlike Christians and Jews, Muslims will kill them for trying to eradicate the 'disease'.
Wow, a different flavor of stupid!

In the last 11 years alone, state-backed xtian Dominationist terrorists have killed far more innocent people than their counterparts among the scattered clumps of Islamic extremists around the world. More than a million people have been killed as a result of the Dominationist terrorist attack on Iraq, for example. Hundreds of innocent people in Pakistan have been murdered by the drones fired by Dominationist terrorists. Dozens are dying monthly in violent Dominationist attacks in Yemen, Somalia, the Philippines and elsewhere.
TheGhostofOtto1923
2.5 / 5 (24) Sep 15, 2012
So. This is how wars start. And we thought it was all about Iranian nukes.

Luckily Those In Charge had the wherewithal to start it some time ago. Just think if islamists had all the weaponry expended in the Arab spring now at their disposal?

It should still prove to be a lively affair. Hey ryggy, would it not be equivalent if freedom-loving Americans were to storm mosques in the same manner that freedom-loving islamists storm consulates? Dont mosques represent a way of life in the same manner as consulates do?

Too bad you xians have discarded that 'eye for an eye' thing in favor of glorious martyrdom eh? No progress can be made AGAINST religions until it is recognized that they are ALL political systems, intent on organizing people and accruing power.

Either they end or the world will end. See? The people are again given no choice but to act. Just when you think your gen is one which has finally outgrown the past, along comes an enemy that you absolutely HAVE to fight.

Win-win.
TheGhostofOtto1923
2.4 / 5 (26) Sep 15, 2012
But actually this war started long before the Arab spring didn't it? Just imagine what this gen of hapless, hungry, disaffected youth would be doing in a Taliban-controlled Afghanistan or an Iraq newly overtaken by Shiite revolutionaries? Good thing Those In Charge had the wherewithal to commandeer those countries and compartmentalize the pending caliphate eh?

But the war began even before then didn't it? It began back when the shah was overthrown and the Process of dividing the people up in orderly and Manageable ways was begun, by giving them an irresistible Cause to fight and die for. Like Nazism. Like Marxism. Like the southern baptists who kindled the Taipei rebellion and killed 20M hapless, hungry, disaffected youth, and their families, and their friends, and their culture.

Same shit different day.
TheGhostofOtto1923
2.4 / 5 (25) Sep 15, 2012
No wait - it began back when israel was established as a bridgehead in the Arab world. No wait - it began back when zionists developed the myth of a Jewish people in the same manner that germanics were being duped in Europe by philosophers or...

Actually there seems to be no beginning to this whole Process does there? Just the realization that it exists.
ryggesogn2
2.6 / 5 (10) Sep 15, 2012
Trouble is for athesits, unlike Christians and Jews, Muslims will kill them for trying to eradicate the 'disease'.
Wow, a different flavor of stupid!

In the last 11 years alone, state-backed xtian Dominationist terrorists have killed far more innocent people than their counterparts among the scattered clumps of Islamic extremists around the world. More than a million people have been killed as a result of the Dominationist terrorist attack on Iraq, for example. Hundreds of innocent people in Pakistan have been murdered by the drones fired by Dominationist terrorists. Dozens are dying monthly in violent Dominationist attacks in Yemen, Somalia, the Philippines and elsewhere.

The atheist communists hold the record for murders.
But if you want to 'live' under Sharia, tomorrow, keep on ignoring the threat. But then the EU and Russia are killing themselves anyway by not reproducing.
VendicarD
3 / 5 (4) Sep 15, 2012
Americans have murdered over 30 million so far.

"The atheist communists hold the record for murders." - RyggTard

kochevnik
1.6 / 5 (7) Sep 15, 2012
Americans have murdered over 30 million so far.

"The atheist communists hold the record for murders." - RyggTard

The American bankers also funded the bolshevek zionists and Hitler. That puts their contribution of bloodshed at over 100 million.
ShotmanMaslo
2.3 / 5 (3) Sep 16, 2012
It would be an insult to the victims of those terrorists to give in to their demands.
obama_socks
1.4 / 5 (10) Sep 16, 2012
Americans have murdered over 30 million so far.

"The atheist communists hold the record for murders." - RyggTard

The American bankers also funded the bolshevek zionists and Hitler. That puts their contribution of bloodshed at over 100 million.
--kochevnik--

Would you kindly provide us with your sources for these allegations about American bankers?
Thanks
Is that Americans murdering WITH, or without provocation? War, as we know, is provocation, depending on who fired the first shot and depending on the threat itself, and therefore cannot be construed as murder if provocation exists.
obama_socks
1.7 / 5 (11) Sep 16, 2012
Indoctrination or brain-washing as a means of inculcating fierce loyalty to a religion and/or ideology has been a traditional "rite of passage" within certain religions and political systems. For example, the minds of children in the Islamic world are most often scrubbed clean of foolish notions such as freedom, individuality, civil and human rights, aspirations, ambition, and tolerance, etc.
They are mostly without hope and grow up floundering in abject poverty in comparison with most westerners, without a reason to exist but for the lessons of Mohammed that were pounded into them.
These people are living with frustration that they don't even recognize as such. Even their requirement of facing East to pray 5 times a day is a regimen that is second nature to them. It is no wonder that their loyalty to and love of Islam precludes any even remote sense of conscientious objection to any act of murder of whomever they consider an infidel. They believe killing is the will of Allah.
VendicarD
3 / 5 (4) Sep 16, 2012
What terrorists? The Israelis?

"It would be an insult to the victims of those terrorists to give in to their demands." - ShotmanTard
VendicarD
3.7 / 5 (3) Sep 16, 2012
Well, that shoots RyggTard's body count out of the water.

He adds the number of Germans killed in WWI and WWII to the Russian body count.

"War, as we know, is provocation, depending on who fired the first shot and depending on the threat itself, and therefore cannot be construed as murder if provocation exists." - Obama Socks
RadiantThoughts
3.7 / 5 (3) Sep 16, 2012
I worry about all those let in under immigration. Say the M-brotherhood declares full war on us and all the internal M's just work like inside agents and attacks us from within. Does this mean perhaps internment camps may be brought back into effect like with the Japanese in WW2.
ryggesogn2
2.3 / 5 (12) Sep 16, 2012
I worry about all those let in under immigration.

How about those who are non 'let in' but illegally cross the border?
The movie Act of Valor suggested Mexican drug cartels smuggled Filipinos into the USA with non-metalic vest bombs.
If tons of marijuana can be smuggled into the USA, or Europe, why not a nuclear weapon or a 'dirty' bomb?
It's only a matter of time as 'liberals' oppose controlling the US border.
Pkunk_
5 / 5 (2) Sep 16, 2012
The poor Americans call it "freedom of speech" because they don't understand that one person's freedom to speak will often remove another person's freedom to live without persecution.

I would pity the people who live under the fear of persecution for acts committed by others. While the "Innocence of Muslims" is a crude film made for the sole purpose of causing offence , aren't the islamofascists proving what the film right with their disgusting behaviour ?
Making children stand with placards calling for beheading anyone who dares utter a word about the "prophet" is civilized ? They are not capable of even understanding what is written on them. The venal hatred of "Kaffirs" starts at a very young age for them.
TheGhostofOtto1923
2.4 / 5 (26) Sep 16, 2012
The atheist communists hold the record for murders.
Well actually ryggy it's a wash isn't it? And this makes you religionists look VERY bad as you are the ones claiming the moral high ground, the ones who are promising to bring heaven to earth with your religions of peace and goodness.

Just as soon, that is, as you eliminate the satanic infidel infestation that is preventing you all from filling up the earth with your own kind, yes?

After all a covenant is a covenant. Better not break this one.
TheGhostofOtto1923
2.4 / 5 (25) Sep 16, 2012
And as I have pointed out many times in the past but am only too happy to repeat, Marx was only selling another brand of religion, using your concepts of morality and the afterlife against you:

"The representation of private interests ... abolishes all natural and spiritual distinctions by enthroning in their stead the immoral, irrational and soulless abstraction of a particular material object and a particular consciousness which is slavishly subordinated to this object.

Marx, On the Thefts of Wood, in Rheinische Zeitung (1842)

-Promises of moral salvation, eternal life, and a vehicle to get you there. Just like Jesus, muhammud, moshiach, siddhartha, et al.
obama_socks
1.7 / 5 (12) Sep 16, 2012
Americans have murdered over 30 million so far.

"The atheist communists hold the record for murders." - RyggTard


Well, that shoots RyggTard's body count out of the water.

He adds the number of Germans killed in WWI and WWII to the Russian body count.

"War, as we know, is provocation, depending on who fired the first shot and depending on the threat itself, and therefore cannot be construed as murder if provocation exists." - Obama Socks
--VendicarD--

Americans killed Japanese, Germans and some Italians during WorldWar2 and rightfully so. Americans were sent off to fight that war to help prevent a world domination and the takeover of Europe by the Nazi Third Reich. In the Pacific, Americans were also called on to fight the Japanese whose goal it was to dominate all of Asia and possibly get a foothold on the West coast of the U.S.
There were German Nazi spies in the U.S. who had to be weeded out and separated from the populace.
obama_socks
1.7 / 5 (12) Sep 16, 2012
But Americans were also told that the Soviets were our allies and to fight the Nazis alongside the Russians. Which was confusing to many, because on one hand, Communism was the enemy of freedom, Capitalism and individualism, and OTOH, the threat of Nazi Germany was worse. So American men fought the Nazis and the Japanese and saved the world. But the Soviet Union led by the Russians was still a totalitarian state and Americans saw in the news and in pictures the disgusting and unrelenting brutality and inhumanity that the Russian leaders heaped on their own people as well as on their satellite countries. And so, we prepared for war with Russia. We saw how the Communists treated each other and dissidents. We read about all the pogroms and the lies told to their own people and the millions of murders the Russian leaders enabled without mercy.
kochevnik
1.8 / 5 (5) Sep 16, 2012
Americans killed Japanese, Germans and some Italians during WorldWar2 and rightfully so.
If they killed Jews you would be singing a different song. But since it's only other ethnicities it's ok for USA to fuck them. That despite the fact US bankers funding Hitler and implanting the Bolsheviks in Russia in the first place.
obama_socks
1.6 / 5 (13) Sep 16, 2012
The Russians have Gorbachev, Yeltsin and Ronald Reagan to thank for not being bombed out of existence. Now, Jihadist Muslims are anxious to have a go at us...and Russia is strangely taking sides against Americans. Quite possibly, the Russians are hoping that Muslims will be the ones to take us out, and the Russians can gain control of the United States with Obama's help if he is reelected.
rwinners
not rated yet Sep 16, 2012
Weird shades of 'The Temptation if Christ".
obama_socks
1.7 / 5 (12) Sep 16, 2012
Americans killed Japanese, Germans and some Italians during WorldWar2 and rightfully so.
If they killed Jews you would be singing a different song. But since it's only other ethnicities it's ok for USA to fuck them. That despite the fact US bankers funding Hitler and implanting the Bolsheviks in Russia in the first place.

--Kochevnik--

I'm not a Jew. I'm American of German ancestry and Lutheran by the Grace of God. I do admire the Jews for their understanding of economics, commerce and business. Those are their strong points. They also excel in science and math, being prompted to study hard and be mentally upwardly mobile in whichever field they choose. I have always tried to emulate these traits, having read about them as a young lad. Jews are also diverse in their religious beliefs, and many are atheists as you well know.

obama_socks
1.7 / 5 (12) Sep 16, 2012
The Jewish understanding of economics encompasses the concepts of "something for something". as in decent pay for decent work done....as opposed to "something for doing nothing in return" or "getting paid for not working", which is a Socialist program in many parts of the world. It's true that many Jews are Socialists and/or Communists, but it is because of their mistaken belief that the down-trodden and poor of the world need a helping hand forever, rather than on a temporary basis.
In the U.S., it's all about retaining power and control over the people. Get them into the welfare checks corral, give them food and shelter, and they will stick with you.
That is the Socialist rope-a-dope method. Certainly, there are many fools living in the U.S. who love being treated like children with all those handouts. But the rest of us who are paying for those freebies with our heavily taxed paycheck are not happy with it.
Jews are resilient people who help each other with many Jewish organizations
kochevnik
1.7 / 5 (6) Sep 16, 2012
I'm not a Jew. I'm American of German ancestry and Lutheran by the Grace of God.
Ok so German let it be. I cannot consider the possibility of killing any of my countrymen for some abstract banker agenda. Only traitor could I consider the possibility, but even this is small chance as the state brands many nationalists as traitors yet it is the state that betrays the nation.

Only religionists and traitors have the requisite psychosis that merits the use of force. Civilians do not deserve death by war yet these are the people the USA kills now. Even USA kills it's own citizens abroad which is proof the government betrays America.
obama_socks
1.7 / 5 (12) Sep 16, 2012
@Kochevnik
I don't see how U.S. bankers could have implanted Bolsheviks in Russia to instigate a Communist takeover. Somehow, the idea of banking and Communism does not compute. A true Bolshevik who could be bought in those days, was not Bolshevik enough and a traitor to his cause.
And U.S. bankers funding the Hitler regime? If that were the case, then the "New World Order" would not be just a conspiracy theory because there are stories that Hitler didn't die in that bunker, but escaped before the Russians arrived and was brought to the U.S., Argentina or Brazil...as was many Nazi SS officers like Blotto's namesake and hero, Otto Skorzeny. U.S. bankers funding Hitler? Well, you know that after WW1, Germany was in very bad shape and leaders in the Fatherland were unable to rectify all the wrongs done to the country. The Jews in Germany lived well and didn't starve as did the Germans. They flaunted their wealth while ethnic Germans went hungry and had to pay rent to the Jews.
obama_socks
1.9 / 5 (13) Sep 16, 2012
I'm not a Jew. I'm American of German ancestry and Lutheran by the Grace of God.
Ok so German let it be. I cannot consider the possibility of killing any of my countrymen for some abstract banker agenda. Only traitor could I consider the possibility, but even this is small chance as the state brands many nationalists as traitors yet it is the state that betrays the nation.

Only religionists and traitors have the requisite psychosis that merits the use of force. Civilians do not deserve death by war yet these are the people the USA kills now. Even USA kills it's own citizens abroad which is proof the government betrays America.

--K--

I personally disapprove of these wars, but circumstances, however unpleasant, do not mitigate the fact that America was, indeed, attacked by suicidal and murderous Jihadists ON U.S. SOIL. They came to us, we did not go to them in 2001. And now they give us even more reason to kill them. Death of their citizens is collateral damage.
ryggesogn2
3 / 5 (10) Sep 16, 2012
I read an interesting note about Muslim societies. Under Muslim law, Jews and Christians were allowed to live in Muslim lands if they paid a tax.
"Often, greedy rulers required them to pay an avania, or protection money. This was simply
a sum of money extorted from the Jewish or Christian communities, under the threat of persecution. This practice of having to pay
for their own protection soon became the norm for dhimmi communities in Muslim lands."
http://churchisra...slam.htm
This is what 'progressive'/socialists demand, too, plunder.
Like 'liberals', the Muslims became the plunderers and the Christians and Jews became the plundered. Muslim society depended upon others to work and create wealth for them to plunder, just like today's 'liberal'.
No wonder 'liberals' today make excuses for the Islamists.
obama_socks
1.7 / 5 (12) Sep 16, 2012
To my mind, wars are stupid and a waste of resources and human life. But there exists on this planet the absolutely human traits of intolerance, jealousy, greed, hatred, self-righteousness, and a host of other evils that the Bible and common sense warns us to avoid. That someone would like to kill you because you're of a certain religion that they hate and find intolerable, or they hate you because you're not a Socialist speaks volumes about the human condition.
We have had a Socialist in the White House for about 3 1/2 years now. Obama has been sending American soldiers to their deaths in Afghanistan and Iraq for all that time, and yet, not one squeak of protest against that policy of death has come from the war protesters. That is VERY strange. Is American deaths OK under Obama's command, but not under Bush's command? Do you see the discrepancy there? Obama is a Democrat, so death of Americans is OK when a Democrat is President? What is wrong w/this picture?
obama_socks
1.7 / 5 (12) Sep 16, 2012
Under Muslim law, Jews and Christians were allowed to live in Muslim lands if they paid a tax.
"Often, greedy rulers required them to pay an avania, or protection money. This was simply
a sum of money extorted from the Jewish or Christian communities, under the threat of persecution. This practice of having to pay
for their own protection soon became the norm for dhimmi communities in Muslim lands."
http://churchisra...slam.htm
This is what 'progressive'/socialists demand, too, plunder.
Muslim society depended upon others to work and create wealth for them to plunder, just like today's 'liberal'.
No wonder 'liberals' today make excuses for the Islamists.
* Rygg*

Sounds somewhat similar to the Mafia, BlackHand, CosaNostra of the Italian mobs. As southern Italy was invaded by Arabs, the Italians may have found extortion to be very profitable without having to work a real job for a living. The seven deadly sins plus murder.
geokstr
3.1 / 5 (15) Sep 17, 2012
This is what 'progressive'/socialists demand, too, plunder.Muslim society depended upon others to work and create wealth for them to plunder, just like today's 'liberal'.No wonder 'liberals' today make excuses for the Islamists.

There are other reasons why the left and Islam are bizarre bedmates. They both believe that the ends justify the means, that children should be indoctrinated to hate their enemies, that only their speech should be free, that the opposition is the embodiment of evil, that lying to advance their respective cults is just peachy, and they both hate America and Bush.

And the leftlings don't seem to hold it against Muslims that they despise everything the left holds dear. They hang gays, believe in a sky fairy, and wow, talk about a "war on women". They also especially loathe atheists and other assorted non-believers, and if they ever gain power, will decapitate them first.

ryggesogn2
2.3 / 5 (9) Sep 17, 2012
To my mind, wars are stupid and a waste of resources and human life.

Of course they are, but there are worse things.
At what point will you fight to protect your liberty from tyrants who will enslave you?
Slavery or war, which is worse? Depends upon if you the slave, but its just as worse for the slave owner since the concept that humans can be the property of another human or the state is deemed valid in such a society.
Better to have a society that believes no human being can be owed by another human or a state and that their rights to life, liberty and property are unalienable and inherent. Is that not worth fighting for?
obama_socks
1.4 / 5 (10) Sep 18, 2012
@ Rygg
We are already at war, as you know. But I would like to see Obama remove every last American soldier out of Afghanistan ASAP and not delay it any longer. Bring them home to guard our southern border states to prevent further illegal border crossings. The fact that it is already 11 years since the Muslim attack on U.S. soil and our military is still sending young men over there to die...and for what?....is offensive to me. Even the Russians could not subdue the wild Afghanis in all the years they were sending conscripted soldiers from the satellite countries to Afghanistan to die, and their mission was still never accomplished.
We are already "slaves" if you count a Socialist system of government that we have now, and that will increase exponentially if Obama remains in the White House as POTUS. If and when we are rid of this evil, we will be able to remove the threat of radical and dangerous Jihadists from our country. But presently, Obama is kissing Muslim ass @home and abroad.
obama_socks
1.4 / 5 (11) Sep 18, 2012
Obama is cutting our military to the bone, and he will most likely use the money saved to fund his Obamacare abomination. He has already stolen a huge amount of money from Medicare to fund it already. For decades, the Democrats stole money from Social Security for their pet projects, and left nothing but I.O.U.s in the "S.S. lockbox". Democrats are famous for stealing from Peter to pay Paul. Maybe Republicans were also guilty of thievery, but I will give them the benefit of the doubt.
The point is...our country is broke, and Obama prints more money to drive us further into the hole. His stimulus programs were a joke, so he will do another stimulus to help out his Wall Street fat cat friends so that they will continue to support Obama. Lots of people in the world don't know how Obama helps Wall Street and the bankers, and they in turn help him. We are already enslaved and his appointees have power over us and our future. Hopefully, we will get rid of Obama in November.
kochevnik
1.7 / 5 (6) Sep 18, 2012
There are other reasons why the left and Islam are bizarre bedmates. They both believe that the ends justify the means, that children should be indoctrinated to hate their enemies, that only their speech should be free, that the opposition is the embodiment of evil, that lying to advance their respective cults is just peachy
No, your OTHER left you klutz.
ryggesogn2
2.2 / 5 (10) Sep 18, 2012
remove every last American soldier out of Afghanistan

The last time that happened a safe haven was created for Islamists to organize, plan and execute major attacks against the west.
A place like Afghanistan is a wonder place to hide out and create nuclear weapons to detonate in the middle of any city.
All they need is one and threaten more.
Then what? Attack Afghanistan again?
Pkunk_
1 / 5 (1) Sep 18, 2012
@geokstr said -
There are other reasons why the left and Islam are bizarre bedmates. They both believe that the ends justify the means, that children should be indoctrinated to hate their enemies, that only their speech should be free, that the opposition is the embodiment of evil, that lying to advance their respective cults is just peachy, and they both hate America and Bush.

Excellent point , in fact the perfect example is Iran and the recent Arab "spring" revolutions.
Both of them were led by leftist idealists who truly believed in human rights , the dignity of the volk and in revolution. In both cases the "revolutions" were hijacked by the Islamists once they wriggled thier way into power.
The first thing the Islamists did in Iran was to KILL , imprison , systematically rape and destroy the Leftists. Now there is no left in Iran , they are all dead or crushed under the Islamofascist heel. The same will soon happen in Egypt and other "spring" nations.
TheGhostofOtto1923
2.7 / 5 (24) Sep 18, 2012
The lying flooder stream of unconsciousness... It ebbs...
I personally disapprove of these wars, but circumstances, however unpleasant, do not mitigate the fact that America was, indeed, attacked by suicidal and murderous Jihadists ON U.S. SOIL.
... and flows...
and our military is still sending young men over there to die...and for what?
-like sewage-laden waves on a gaza beach. Or like this:
http://www.youtub...a_player

-A dozen posts of back-to-back catch phrases. So do we fight or not pussytard? Don't know? Doesn't matter? Only posting matters I know.
All they need is one and threaten more.
Then what? Attack Afghanistan again?
See? Even conservatives think you're full of shit. Like gaza beach waves.
ryggesogn2
2.5 / 5 (11) Sep 18, 2012
The first thing the Islamists did in Iran was to KILL , imprison , systematically rape and destroy the Leftists.


That's what all tyrants do, even the leftest ones. Which is one reason the 'liberals' are called useful idiots.
obama_socks
1.4 / 5 (11) Sep 19, 2012
TheghostofBlotto tries to hide his jealousy remarkably well for someone who is nuttier than a squirrel's winter stash. What the hell is a sewage-laden waves on a gaza beach that Blotto is referring to? That wasn't me who said that. Catch phrases? Where?
Fight? We are already fighting them, you idiot.
Blotto evidently forgot to take his meds to relieve his psychosis again. He wants to take part in the discussion with the grown-ups but doesn't know how to do it without saying stupid things. Poor poor Blotto. Did he drive Estevan57 away from this site too, like he probably did to all the others? I wonder.
obama_socks
1.6 / 5 (7) Sep 19, 2012
remove every last American soldier out of Afghanistan

The last time that happened a safe haven was created for Islamists to organize, plan and execute major attacks against the west.
A place like Afghanistan is a wonder place to hide out and create nuclear weapons to detonate in the middle of any city.
All they need is one and threaten more.
Then what? Attack Afghanistan again?
* Rygg *

NO!!! Definitely NOT go into Afghanistan again. Next time, we give them a warning, and if they don't heed the warning, then we dispatch a couple of ICBMs with nuclear warheads their way and send them to heaven and their 72 virgins.

If Israel takes out Iran, then all hell will break loose anyway like a deadly food fight in a high school cafeteria. Israel is growing more desperate. In the meantime, Obama continues to ignore Netanyahu. I wonder sometimes, where is the President. He's nowhere to be found. Obama is no President no matter how many fools and idiots elected him.
ryggesogn2
2.3 / 5 (9) Sep 19, 2012
then we dispatch a couple of ICBMs with nuclear warheads

I am sure all those downwind will appreciate that.

You sound like one of the crazy Paulites. Hide behind the border and lob nukes at anyone who threatens.

The best defense is an offense and the will to offend.

The French thought they cold hide behind a wall. The Germans went around it.

Allowing those who would attack you a safe haven in a nation-state is nuts.

The problem with Afghanistan now is execution and will.

After Charlie Wilson's war defeated the Soviets, Congress pulled the plug just when we had the Afghan people on our side. The same thing happened in Viet Nam. Congress abandoned South Vietnam and millions of Cambodians died.
Lack of will is to blame.
Why should anyone trust the USA to 'help' them?
Caliban
5 / 5 (1) Sep 19, 2012
After Charlie Wilson's war defeated the Soviets, Congress pulled the plug just when we had the Afghan people on our side. The same thing happened in Viet Nam. Congress abandoned South Vietnam and millions of Cambodians died.
Lack of will is to blame.

Why should anyone trust the USA to 'help' them?



Right on, riggsuckn!

Why don't you hie yer spotted backside over there to Afghanistan and show them that America WILL help them and has the WILL to help them prevail?

You can do it!!!!


ryggesogn2
2.3 / 5 (9) Sep 19, 2012

It's always the 'liberals' who cut and run abandoning any friends we attempt to make. Ted Kennedy abandoned Cambodia to communist murder, Carter abandoned Iran to the Islamists, Clinton abandoned Somalia, Obama abandoned Israel, Libya, Egypt, ....
TheGhostofOtto1923
2.6 / 5 (23) Sep 20, 2012
What the hell is a sewage-laden waves on a gaza beach that Blotto is referring to? That wasn't me who said that.
That was a metaphor for the turd gumbo you constantly serve up (that is another metaphor.) stew like this:
then we dispatch a couple of ICBMs with nuclear warheads
-To which ryggy replies:
You sound like one of the crazy Paulites. Hide behind the border and lob nukes at anyone who threatens.
-See? Even conservative think you are full of it. Despite your generous use of brainless suckup buzzwords.
TheghostofBlotto tries to hide his jealousy remarkably well
Yes well I am not the master shit chef that you are.

Say how is your cat Diarrhea?
obama_socks
1.6 / 5 (7) Sep 21, 2012
If I had a cat, (which I don't), I would probably name it OTTO SKORZENY and dress it up like a NAZI so I could kick its ass every time it came anywhere near me.
OttoBlotto calls himself Otto Skorzeny because he is the grandson of that disgusting Nazi turd, and Blotto wanted to sleep with his momma, but his grandpoa Otto beat him to it.
I heard that Blotto auditioned for the role of "SpongeBob Squarepants" and actually got the job. That's why he has made another sock puppet called "LITE" ( lite ) so that he can hide behind that also when he wants to avoid using "theghostofotto1923...the little coward.

Blotto keeps referring to a pussytard. He proves all the time that he hates pussy, but he knows all about smegma. That was one of the threads where he claimed that PussycatEyes wasn't a nurse because she didn't spit out that word immediately. Probably to keep Blotto from jacking off while reading about penises.
obama_socks
1.6 / 5 (7) Sep 21, 2012
then we dispatch a couple of ICBMs with nuclear warheads

I am sure all those downwind will appreciate that.

You sound like one of the crazy Paulites. Hide behind the border and lob nukes at anyone who threatens.

The best defense is an offense and the will to offend.

The French thought they cold hide behind a wall. The Germans went around it.

Allowing those who would attack you a safe haven in a nation-state is nuts.

The problem with Afghanistan now is execution and will.

After Charlie Wilson's war defeated the Soviets, Congress pulled the plug just when we had the Afghan people on our side. The same thing happened in Viet Nam. Congress abandoned South Vietnam and millions of Cambodians died.
Lack of will is to blame.
Why should anyone trust the USA to 'help' them?

* Rygg *

Is it best to keep sending our soldiers there to be murdered by Afghani soldiers and civilians who pretend to be on our side? Those people cannot be trusted.
obama_socks
1.6 / 5 (7) Sep 21, 2012
We could send a million of our young soldiers to Afghanistan and get the same results. The Afghanis and Pakis are not our friends. They sell themselves to the highest bidder like mercenaries. They smile in your face and stab you in the back, even when their President Karzai pretends he's a friend of the U.S. That's their culture.
And now, the Obama administration is finally admitting that it wasn't that stupid video that caused the violence in Libya after all; and that the murders of an ambassador who lacked proper and adequate security in that embassy was preplanned by al-quaeda. Our own government tells us big, fat lies to save Obama's own reputation. He apologizes for U.S. foreign policy, but continues to send soldiers to be massacred.
You cannot reason with al-quaeda or hezbollah. They have their agendas, and that's to kill us. When Iran deploys their nuclear warheads (with Russia's help), I am certain Pakistan will also use theirs. Armadgeddon.
obama_socks
2 / 5 (8) Sep 21, 2012

It's always the 'liberals' who cut and run abandoning any friends we attempt to make. Ted Kennedy abandoned Cambodia to communist murder, Carter abandoned Iran to the Islamists, Clinton abandoned Somalia, Obama abandoned Israel, Libya, Egypt, ....
* Rygg *

Yes, and that's because American liberals/Socialists always insist on things being "fair"....you know, a "level playing field". If America is winning a war, or if America has a bigger nuclear weapons stockpile than Russia, China or even India, or if successful American businessmen have become millionaires or billionaires through their own competence and hard work....why, America has to be brought down a peg or three and get off their high horse...be like the rest of the world. Wallow in misery and poverty like everyone else who does.
obama_socks
1.7 / 5 (6) Sep 21, 2012
Even Obama the Socialist said, in 1998, that he believes in redistribution. That's redistributing wealth from the hard workers who are upwardly mobile and want an improved standard of living, and either cutting their take-home salaries by taxing them at a much higher rate and giving their wealth to the lazy bums who have become the pigs at the government trough permanently.

Liberals/Socialists, as usual, believe in everyone else's money being redistributed to the lazy bums of the world, but it would be a freezing day in hell before the rich Liberals/Socialists will agree to the redistribution of their own wealth...unless a tax loophole is found where they can get their money returned to them.
They like to remind Muslims in the Middle East that they are poor while Americans are rich. It foments jealousy and other emotions...like hatred. That's the liberal way...to cause trouble between rich and poor..
kochevnik
2.2 / 5 (6) Sep 21, 2012
That's redistributing wealth from the hard workers who are upwardly mobile and want an improved standard of living, and either cutting their take-home salaries by taxing them at a much higher rate and giving their wealth to the lazy bums who have become the pigs at the government trough permanently.
Why do you hate Wall Street, utilities, tele-communications, and oil, gas & pipelines? They are only 56 percent of the total US government tax subsidies: http://thinkprogr...ch-ones/
ryggesogn2
1.6 / 5 (7) Sep 21, 2012
Is it best to keep sending our soldiers there to be murdered by Afghani soldiers and civilians who pretend to be on our side? Those people cannot be trusted.


Some can, some can't.
Find those who can and kill those who can't.
Bin Ladin noted how Clinton ran away in Somalia after a few soldiers were killed.
I agree, if the war is not going to be prosecuted with extreme prejudice to win, leave. But don't be surprised when a suitcase nuke from Afghanistan goes off in Dallas.
The USA can't hide behind its porous borders. And even if the USA did control its borders, it should still not hide. Is the USA ashamed of liberty? People who run away and hide are ashamed. But then maybe the Paulites should be ashamed for not being willing to defend liberty.
Meyer
3.7 / 5 (3) Sep 21, 2012
But don't be surprised when a suitcase nuke from Afghanistan goes off in Dallas.

That is a terrifying prospect. Now I am so terrified that I support increasing the budget for war, domestic surveillance, drug enforcement, private weapons contracts (especially for companies in my district), and even national defense to $2,000,000/minute, because $1,000,000/minute has just not been enough to feel non-terrified.
ryggesogn2
1.5 / 5 (8) Sep 21, 2012
But don't be surprised when a suitcase nuke from Afghanistan goes off in Dallas.

That is a terrifying prospect. Now I am so terrified that I support increasing the budget for war, domestic surveillance, drug enforcement, private weapons contracts (especially for companies in my district), and even national defense to $2,000,000/minute, because $1,000,000/minute has just not been enough to feel non-terrified.

The entire defense budget is ~2% of GDP.
How much economic activity, and lives, would be lost if a major US city was made to be uninhabitable?
Funny how 'liberals' and Libertarians are so concerned about the defense budget but don't say too much about the waste in all other govt spending.
TheGhostofOtto1923
2.6 / 5 (20) Sep 23, 2012
OttoBlotto calls himself Otto Skorzeny because he is the grandson of that disgusting Nazi turd, and Blotto wanted to sleep with his momma, but his grandpoa Otto beat him to it.
Funny, the lying flooding dimwit pirouette/Ritchieguy/russkiye/pussycat/pititepatootie/jewzrule/estevan57 used to say these exact same things.
wasn't that stupid video that caused the violence in Libya after all; and that the murders of an ambassador who lacked proper and adequate security in that embassy
Hard to imagine an embassy security adequate to protect it from 120 heavily armed paramilitaries with RPGs and mortars, no? Does NASA where you work as a nurse offer security courses?
ryggesogn2
1.7 / 5 (6) Sep 23, 2012
Libertarians:

"Those who expect to reap the blessings of liberty must undergo the fatigues of supporting it"

"He that would make his own liberty secure must guard even his enemy from oppression;for if he violates this duty he establishes a precedent that will reach to himself."

and

"That government is best which governs least."

Thomas Paine
TheGhostofOtto1923
2.8 / 5 (18) Sep 23, 2012
Libertarians:

"Those who expect to reap the blessings of liberty must undergo the fatigues of supporting it"

"He that would make his own liberty secure must guard even his enemy from oppression;for if he violates this duty he establishes a precedent that will reach to himself."

and

"That government is best which governs least."

Thomas Paine
Religion is oppression and we must fight to protect everyone from it. It will go the way of monarchism, fascism, and freemarketeering. Trust me.
ryggesogn2
2.1 / 5 (7) Sep 23, 2012
The US Declaration of Independence reiterated the critical axiom that all men are created equal, endowed by their Creator with inherent, unalienable rights to life, liberty and property.
From this axiom, individuals with these inherent rights may collaborate and create a government to protect those rights.
Socialist/atheists refuse to accept that axiom which then leads to a tyrannical government that does not protect the individual's rights but claims to be their source and individuals must then worship the State.
This is why socialists are fellow travelers with Islam. Islam is a tyrannical form of government demanding submission.

Where is the anti-religionists alternative? Atheist Rand suggests one consistent with inherent axiom.
TheGhostofOtto1923
2.8 / 5 (18) Sep 23, 2012
The US Declaration of Independence reiterated the critical axiom that all men are created equal, endowed by their Creator with inherent, unalienable rights to life, liberty and property.
Yes this is in need of a serious rewrite. The notion of a creator is offensive, FALSE, and discriminatory.
From this axiom, individuals with these inherent rights may collaborate and create a government to protect those rights.
-Except when they inevitably begin debating the nature of their creator, and whom this creator likes best.

Perhaps he liked Joseph smith best? Enough so that he allowed joey to forge heiroglyphics and claim god told him they were authentic images of Moses and Joseph?

Perhaps your buddy mitt getting elected would confirm this. Then all the other denominations could begin paying taxes which is only fair.

One godlover is as good as another anyway, right? Ask moroni pbuh. It's in the constitution you know.
ryggesogn2
2.1 / 5 (7) Sep 23, 2012
The notion of a creator is offensive, FALSE, and discriminatory.

Which makes it so much easier for the socialists to murder individual human beings to 'save' mankind.

The notion of a creator is offensive, FALSE, and discriminatory.

How intolerant!
TheGhostofOtto1923
2.8 / 5 (18) Sep 23, 2012
This is why socialists are fellow travelers with Islam. Islam is a tyrannical form of government demanding submission.
Well they all are when they are allowed to govern aren't they? That's why most govts have laws against this. But you are right, as I have shown you many times before, socialism is only one more religion.

"The representation of private interests ... abolishes all natural and spiritual distinctions by enthroning in their stead the immoral, irrational and soulless abstraction of a particular material object and a particular consciousness which is slavishly subordinated to this object." -Marx, Karl

-I bet I could find similar references to the soul, morality, 'spiritual', and consciousness, in your favorite freemarket literature yes? Same crap - different book.
TheGhostofOtto1923
2.8 / 5 (18) Sep 23, 2012
Which makes it so much easier for the socialists to murder individual human beings to 'save' mankind.
Yeah they just defer to the spirit and the soul as the source of their moral justification for doing so, just like any other religion. Including yours.
How intolerant!
Religions are the source of intolerance. They are the institutionalization of the tribal dynamic; internal altruism coupled with external animosity. The ones which have survived are the ones which are best at this. Those not quite as adept have all been overrun and extincted.

The only way you all can get around this is by viewing everybody else as potential converts. But this magnanimity never lasts. Sooner or later you're driving truck bombs or cutting off each others beards.
TheGhostofOtto1923
2.7 / 5 (18) Sep 23, 2012
This is why socialists are fellow travelers with Islam. Islam is a tyrannical form of government demanding submission.
So ryggy I dont suppose you think this would work out very well?

"Syrian rebels said to seek Islamic democracy
by Oren Dorell, USA TODAY
Syrian opposition members generally want a democratic government that protects the rights of minorities, though many also want a constitution based on Islam, according to a recent survey."
ryggesogn2
2.3 / 5 (6) Sep 23, 2012
Democracy is mob rule.
"We have no government, armed with power, capable of contending with human passions, unbridled by morality and religion.

Avarice, ambition, revenge and licentiousness would break the strongest cords of our Constitution, as a whale goes through a net.

Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.

John Adams, Letter to the Officers of the First Brigade of the Third Division of the Militia of Massachusetts, 11 October 1798"
ryggesogn2
2.5 / 5 (8) Sep 23, 2012
socialism is only one more religion.

Which is Otto's, and all other atheist's and anti-reltionist's, religion.
kochevnik
1.8 / 5 (5) Sep 23, 2012
The notion of a creator is offensive, FALSE, and discriminatory.
How intolerant!
Tolerating organized intolerance, such as monotheism, is no better that intolerance itself.
ryggesogn2
1.8 / 5 (5) Sep 23, 2012
Tolerating organized intolerance, such as monotheism, is no better that intolerance itself.

How you plan to ban religion without subjugating all humans to the state?
The most powerful governments in the world and history, Egypt, Persia Rome, NAZIs, have tried to murder the Jews and have failed.
What is Koch's plan to exterminate the Jews and why will he succeed when so many have failed?
ryggesogn2
2.1 / 5 (7) Sep 23, 2012
Syrian rebels said to seek Islamic democracy

Islamic democracy is an oxymoron.

But it would be very useful for all the Arabs to elect the govts of their choice and be held accountable for their actions.
TheGhostofOtto1923
3.3 / 5 (14) Sep 24, 2012
Egypt, Persia Rome, NAZIs, have tried to murder the Jews and have failed.
Uh these were all religion-based. Their gods told them how to treat Jews.

So I guess if the following people had religion they would know how to behave themselves and accept freemarket oppression?

"Taiwan-based Foxconn Technology, a major supplier for Apple, has halted production at a plant in northern China after a fight broke out among workers.

Foxconn confirmed that a "personal dispute" escalated into an incident involving about 2,000 workers, injuring 40 of them.

Police later dealt with the situation near the facility in Taiyuan, which employs about 79,000 workers.

Foxconn has previously been accused of having poor conditions for its workers.

Foxconn has since agreed to reduce hours, protect pay and improve staff representation."
TheGhostofOtto1923
3.3 / 5 (14) Sep 24, 2012
socialism is only one more religion.

Which is Otto's, and all other atheist's and anti-reltionist's, religion.
Naw you know me. I think all your -isms are only Tools to be used at the proper Time, in the proper Place, to achieve the proper Effect. 'Everything is beautiful in it's own Time', don't you know. None of them can work by itself for long. And none of them can be ALLOWED to work by itself as a result.

It's like a Cycle you see. Like waves on a beach or the tides. 'There is a season for everything.'
ryggesogn2
1.8 / 5 (5) Sep 24, 2012
freemarket oppression?

That pegs Auto's religion.

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