Many US families are underwater with debts: study

May 08, 2012

As the country emerges from the Great Recession, a substantial number of U.S. families are underwater—and not just with their mortgages.

According to a new University of Michigan report, about one out of every five U.S. households owe more on credit cards, medical bills, student loans and other noncollateralized debts than they have in savings and other liquid assets.

The report also predicts continuing trouble ahead for home mortgages, with 1.7 percent of families surveyed in 2011 saying that it is "very or somewhat likely" that they will fall behind on their mortgage payments in the near future. This represents an improvement from 2009, however, when 1.9 percent of families had such expectations.

"Our data suggest that the mortgage crisis will continue for the next few years, although a somewhat smaller share of families will experience mortgage distress," said Frank Stafford, an economist at the U-M Institute for Social Research (ISR) and co-author of the report with U-M researchers Bing Chen and Robert Schoeni.

"And even though average savings levels have gone up since 2008, our data show that there has been no improvement in financial liquidity between 2009 and 2011, except among families with more than $50,000 in savings and other liquid assets."

The report is based on an analysis of home ownership, mortgage and other debt, and financial resources among the same 8,121 families interviewed before and after the economic downturn. The families were interviewed as part of the ISR Panel Study of Income Dynamics, the longest running longitudinal household survey in the world.

Among the key findings:

  • About 3.5 percent of families owned a home and were behind on their mortgage payments in either 2009 or 2011, or in both years. While these percentages are low, the number of families affected is significant—approximately 4.1 million on a national level.
  • The proportion of families with no savings or other liquid assets rose to 23.4 percent in 2011, up from 18.5 percent in 2009.
  • About the same percentage of families in 2009 and 2011 had $30,000 or more in credit card and other noncollateralized debts (8.5 percent vs.10 percent), and about the same proportion (48.0 percent vs. 47.4 percent) had no such debt in both years.
"Some families have not been able to make substantial headway," Stafford said. "Even if they're not underwater with their mortgages, they are struggling to save money and reduce their debts."

Stafford says the situation today follows a scenario described by the 1920s economist, Irving Fisher.

"In Fisher's 'Debt Deflation Theory of Great Depressions,' he predicted that when people are optimistic about a broad investment category, as they were before the Great Depression and now in the housing bubble of the Great , there is a companion rise of excessive indebtedness," he said. "Once the bubble in the underlying asset has burst there is a rush to safe assets, as in 2009-2010. In short, as the inevitable collapse happens, they rush to get rid of their and start saving more.

"It's a classic response to economic uncertainty. But the problem is that today only those families who have more than $50,000 in liquid assets have actually been able to do this to any extent. The rest of American families are simply treading water, if they're lucky."

Explore further: 3 Qs: Economist makes the case for new quasi-experiments as a way of studying environmental issues

More information: Study: psidonline.isr.umich.edu/Publications/Papers/tsp/2012-02_MortgageDistress.pdf

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Lurker2358
3 / 5 (13) May 08, 2012
According to a new University of Michigan report, about one out of every five U.S. households owe more on credit cards, medical bills, student loans and other noncollateralized debts than they have in savings and other liquid assets.


Duh.

School debts now cost 1 to 3 years worth of your entire life income to pay off, and often don't even result in a higher paying job.

Ironically, some of the best paying jobs that require a college degree actually are the easiest ones to pass, such as journalism and nursing, particularly by the time you consider they only work 36 hours per week.

Don't be a fool. Stay OUT OF SCHOOL, at least don't go into STEM, because it's harder, costs more, and it doesn't pay as much unless you're in a management level position.

Starting your adult life off with 100k to 200k in school debts is a recipe for failure.
CHollman82
4.3 / 5 (6) May 08, 2012
only one in five? Surprisingly low actually... I certainly owe more in student loans than I have in liquid assets, otherwise I would pay off the damn loan!
dschlink
5 / 5 (2) May 08, 2012
I'm in the half that doesn't use credit for instant gratification. The cards are just for ease of payment. Letting debt, other than a mortgage or a car loan, exceed 25% of your monthly income is a stupid move. I've always paid off the balance, even when I was only making $6500 a year.

Borrowing to go to college only makes sense if the degree has earning potential. Yeah, there are times when even a good degree doesn't guaranty a job, but they pass.
CHollman82
4.2 / 5 (5) May 08, 2012
I'm in the half that doesn't use credit for instant gratification.


yeah, me too, but my debts are still much more than my liquid assets, which is what the article is talking about.
ryggesogn2
1.8 / 5 (11) May 08, 2012
Every US taxpayer is underwater with thousands $ of national debt.

As long as the govt continues to inflate the currency, paying off debt with cheaper $$ is a good idea.
Vendicar_Decarian
2.5 / 5 (13) May 08, 2012
Americans can thank borrow and spend republicans for that.

"Every US taxpayer is underwater with thousands $ of national debt." - RyggTard

The Libertarian Program to starve the beast of big government through fiscal bankruptcy has been promoted by Libertarian Think Tanks for decades.

This article in Forbes explains much of this Libertarian/Randite/Republican treason.

http://www.forbes...ett.html
Lurker2358
2.8 / 5 (8) May 08, 2012
V_D:

One problem is almost nobody, including the fools in government itself, really understands what a "Trillion" dollars is.

This country's debt is so big it's ridiculous.

I figure another ten years of this, give or take, and our government will collapse, because that's about when the interest on the debt will become impossible to keep up with, and probably the single largest item on the budget.

IF there were a million millionaires and they all paid 100% tax rate, that would be a trillion dollars of revenue to the government, which isn't even enough to cancel the deficit.

If we wanted to actually pay off the debt, we'd need nearly 15 million millionaires to pay 100% taxes.
kaasinees
2.8 / 5 (11) May 09, 2012
Massive debts are the bankers way of controlling economies and the population. Its their answer to this over overpopulated consumptious shit economies.

We need to do something about india and pakistan etc. Those shit holes are overpopulating and polluting the planet(one of the biggest in the world). At least china is working to become green and they have rules to curb population growth.
jscroft
1.8 / 5 (5) May 09, 2012
One wonders what this study cost the U.S. taxpayer.
Vendicar_Decarian
2.5 / 5 (11) May 09, 2012
I think this is true.

"One problem is almost nobody, including the fools in government itself, really understands what a "Trillion" dollars is." - Lurker

Through the 80's and 90's as Republicans were destroying their own country with massive deficits, I made it a point to tell Americans that they were destroying their own nation.

The response I got was invariably one of complete ignorant denial, often using the same dismissive rhetoric that came from the mouth of Conservative Clowns like Rush Limbaugh.

So I began to ask Americans how big their national debt was.

I was astonished to find that only about 1 percent of Americans knew what their debt was - even roughly - with most answers being "it doesn't matter", and a few being "big".

Most of the respondents couldn't tell the difference between 10 million a billion and a trillion.

It was obvious to me at that point that America was a dying nation.

Vendicar_Decarian
2.5 / 5 (11) May 09, 2012
And virtually every dollar of that debt was created by Republican/Libertarian fiscal policy.

"If we wanted to actually pay off the debt, we'd need nearly 15 million millionaires to pay 100% taxes." - Lurker

You really do need to read the following link.

Starve the Beast of big government through federal bankruptcy has long been the Republican game plan.

http://www.forbes...ett.html

For more than 30 years, since the election of Ronald Reagan in 1980, some Republicans have pursued a theory called Starve the Beast. - Bloomberg

http://www.bloomb...iew.html
ryggesogn2
1.9 / 5 (9) May 09, 2012
Massive debts are the bankers way of controlling economies and the population.

Governments control the bankers as they print the money.
kaasinees
2 / 5 (8) May 09, 2012
Massive debts are the bankers way of controlling economies and the population.

Governments control the bankers as they print the money.

Federalees dont answer to government. The governmentS answers to them.
NotParker
1.4 / 5 (10) May 09, 2012
Apple has left 60 billion dollars offshore because US corporate taxes are the highest in the world. Poor people, hammered by incompetent Obama and super high energy costs and taxes, do not have the option of emulating Al Gore - Apple Board Member.
ryggesogn2
1.6 / 5 (7) May 09, 2012
Massive debts are the bankers way of controlling economies and the population.

Governments control the bankers as they print the money.

Federalees dont answer to government. The governmentS answers to them.

What bank is allowed by any govt to print money?
What is a 'Federalees'? Mexican national police?
kaasinees
1.7 / 5 (6) May 09, 2012
What bank is allowed by any govt to print money?
What is a 'Federalees'? Mexican national police?

The "Mexican" national police is a foreign institution.
Mexico has been secretly a federal state for quite a while now.
(This is why Mexicans call them federales, i know you have googled/wikipedia the word federales)

Mexican people have been raped by the inquisition and now the USA.
And then you wonder why there are so many Mexican gangs. They are poor because of foreigner rape, ofcourse they want to fuck you up.
I cheer for them every time they hang a banker.
ryggesogn2
1.6 / 5 (7) May 09, 2012
What bank is allowed by any govt to print money?
What is a 'Federalees'? Mexican national police?

The "Mexican" national police is a foreign institution.
Mexico has been secretly a federal state for quite a while now.
(This is why Mexicans call them federales, i know you have googled/wikipedia the word federales)

Mexican people have been raped by the inquisition and now the USA.
And then you wonder why there are so many Mexican gangs. They are poor because of foreigner rape, ofcourse they want to fuck you up.
I cheer for them every time they hang a banker.

'Progressives' do love violence.
But the govt of Mexico still controls their money.
kaasinees
1.6 / 5 (7) May 09, 2012
And fascists love to see millions if not billions people starve to death, who is the violent one here?

Also govt manages the money, it does not control it any way, that is the banks job.
NotParker
1.5 / 5 (8) May 09, 2012
And fascists love to see millions if not billions people starve to death


Communism starves people to death (among other methods) and has killed 100,000,000

Environmentalism has killed 100,000,000 by banning DDT.

Fascism tends to gas and shoot people (but Communism likes shooting too).
kaasinees
2.3 / 5 (6) May 09, 2012
How exactly has "communism" killed 100m people and starved people to death?
ryggesogn2
1.5 / 5 (8) May 09, 2012
And fascists love to see millions if not billions people starve to death, who is the violent one here?

Also govt manages the money, it does not control it any way, that is the banks job.

Fascists are socialist.
Govt creates the money, inflates is value, sets rules and regulations controlling the economy and subsidizes industries and groups it favors and taxes those it does not favor.
Banks are instruments of the state which is why the Federal Reserve has a .gov web-site and its chairman is appointed by the president.
kaasinees
2.3 / 5 (6) May 09, 2012
Fascists are socialist.

No they arent, fascism is a whole different scale than "capitalism vs socialism".

Aldrich's bill met much opposition from politicians. Critics charged Aldrich of being biased due to his close ties to wealthy bankers such as J. P. Morgan and John D. Rockefeller, Jr., Aldrich's son-in-law. Most Republicans favored the Aldrich Plan,[36] but it lacked enough support in Congress to pass because rural and western states viewed it as favoring the "eastern establishment".[2] In contrast, progressive Democrats favored a reserve system owned and operated by the government; they believed that public ownership of the central bank would end Wall Street's control of the American currency supply.[36] Conservative Democrats fought for a privately owned, yet decentralized, reserve system, which would still be free of Wall Street's control.[36]
Terriva
3 / 5 (6) May 09, 2012
This drawing illustrates it well. The people living from debts should accept, they will have to pay it some day.
ryggesogn2
1.4 / 5 (9) May 09, 2012
No they arent, fascism is a whole different scale than "capitalism vs socialism".

Fascists/socialists/communists''progressives' all support and advocate state control of private property.
They may disagree on the means, but they all agree on the ends, state control.
Terriva
1.8 / 5 (5) May 09, 2012
The somewhat silly is, the physicists know about solution of energetic and economical crisis for twenty years - but they're ignoring it as a single man for no to threat their existing jobs and salaries. Prof. Hagelstain at MIT generates excess energy in the form of heat is produced which is over 14 times the input energy - for five months of uninterrupted run already. I just hope, we succeed with implementation of cold fusion before the USA will end with global nuclear war with Iran or China. Every of you should urge the local politicians to invest into cold fusion research by now. It's the only way, which can save the life environment, too.
NotParker
1 / 5 (7) May 09, 2012
How exactly has "communism" killed 100m people and starved people to death?


S"Joseph Stalin, leader of the Soviet Union, set in motion events designed to cause a famine in the Ukraine to destroy the people there seeking independence from his rule. As a result, an estimated 7,000,000 persons perished in this farming area, known as the breadbasket of Europe, with the people deprived of the food they had grown with their own hands."

http://www.histor...alin.htm

149 million

http://www.scottm...y-count/

ryggesogn2
1 / 5 (7) May 09, 2012
"The most absolute Power, that is the communist U.S.S.R., China and preceding Mao guerrillas, Khmer Rouge Cambodia, Vietnam, and Yugoslavia, as well fascist Nazi Germany, account for near 128,000,000 of them, or 84 percent. "
http://www.hawaii...HAP1.HTM
"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." -
-- C.S. Lewis
http://www.quoted...tes/2069
Vendicar_Decarian
3.3 / 5 (7) May 10, 2012
Capitalist America alone has killed over 30 million people over it's history.

And of course every death that occurs due to a Capitalist refusing to provide medical care without payment is a murder by the Capitalist system.

Those murders by Capitalists now number into the hundreds of millions.

"Communism starves people to death (among other methods) and has killed 100,000,000" - ParkerTard
NotParker
1 / 5 (6) May 10, 2012
Capitalist America alone has killed over 30 million people over it's history.

And of course every death that occurs due to a Capitalist refusing to provide medical care without payment is a murder by the Capitalist system.

Those murders by Capitalists now number into the hundreds of millions.

"Communism starves people to death (among other methods) and has killed 100,000,000" - ParkerTard


I see that VD and his STD's are trying to deflect criticism of all kinds of genocide -- including environmental genocide caused by the DDT ban.

VD and his STD ilk are the future genocidal murderers. VD has fantasized about killing his enemies on this discussion board numerous times.

If you think AGW is about saving the world think again. It's ultimate goal is the eradication of the industrial economies and a return to the good old days when people died at 40 if they were lucky.

When he rants about capitalism killing people,he wants to end modern medicine completely.
Vendicar_Decarian
3.4 / 5 (5) May 11, 2012
Effective Corporate Tax rate, Economic growth rate (2011)

USA. 37.8%, 1.5%
China 47.1%, 9.5%
Brazil 36.6%, 2.8%

CD Howe Institute

"Apple has left 60 billion dollars offshore because US corporate taxes are the highest in the world." - ParkerTard
Vendicar_Decarian
3.4 / 5 (5) May 11, 2012
Somehow ParkerTard conflates the 30 million murders committed by America with the advance of medicine. No doubt he insists that the medical experimentation in NAZI death camps was justified as well.

"When he rants about capitalism killing people,he wants to end modern medicine completely." - ParkerTard

Poor Confused, mentally ill, ParkerTard.
Vendicar_Decarian
3 / 5 (6) May 11, 2012
Conservatives don't constitute a race, hence the term "genocidal" doesn't apply.

Civil war is coming to America. Progressives should have their lists ready so that they may take action to exterminate the Conservative cancer that has destroyed their nation.

"VD and his STD ilk are the future genocidal murderers. VD has fantasized about killing his enemies on this discussion board numerous times." - ParkerTard
Vendicar_Decarian
3 / 5 (6) May 11, 2012
America has no industrial economy since it was offshored by Conservative/Libertarian traitors.

"It's ultimate goal is the eradication of the industrial economies" - ParkerTard
Vendicar_Decarian
3.4 / 5 (5) May 11, 2012
Does this make America half as evil for murdering 3 million civilians in Vietnam? Or does it make America 1.5 times as evil for murdering 8 million native Americans as well?

"As a result, an estimated 7,000,000 persons perished in this farming area" - ParkerTard
NotParker
1 / 5 (5) May 11, 2012
Does this make America half as evil for murdering 3 million civilians in Vietnam?


While I agree the Democratic Party was run by mass murdering left wing douchebags when they started the war in Vietnam ... Communists in Cambodia were much better mass murderers.
ryggesogn2
1 / 5 (4) May 11, 2012
Does this make America half as evil for murdering 3 million civilians in Vietnam?


While I agree the Democratic Party was run by mass murdering left wing douchebags when they started the war in Vietnam ... Communists in Cambodia were much better mass murderers.

All with the blessings of Ted Kennedy, whose brother launched US involvement.
How many tens of thousands of Vietnamese escaped after Congress cut off funding?
ryggesogn2
1.2 / 5 (5) May 11, 2012
But there ARE less expensive schools.
When govt subsidizes health care, school, costs rise.
Want to lower costs, stop the subsidies.
IronhorseA
3.3 / 5 (3) May 12, 2012
And fascists love to see millions if not billions people starve to death


Communism starves people to death (among other methods) and has killed 100,000,000

Environmentalism has killed 100,000,000 by banning DDT.

Fascism tends to gas and shoot people (but Communism likes shooting too).


Communism and Fascism as practiced in the world for the last 100 years are like 2 walls with different coats of paint. They may look different but they're still walls.
antialias_physorg
5 / 5 (5) May 12, 2012
When govt subsidizes health care, school, costs rise.
Want to lower costs, stop the subsidies.

And yet: All other countries with paid-by-the-state schools/universities and socialized healtcare spend less than the US does - and get better results.

Something doesn't work with your 'logic'.
IronhorseA
not rated yet May 12, 2012
Does this make America half as evil for murdering 3 million civilians in Vietnam?


While I agree the Democratic Party was run by mass murdering left wing douchebags when they started the war in Vietnam ... Communists in Cambodia were much better mass murderers.

All with the blessings of Ted Kennedy, whose brother launched US involvement.
How many tens of thousands of Vietnamese escaped after Congress cut off funding?


American involvement started with President Eisenhower. The war phase didn't start till 1964, after JFK was killed. There is suspicion that JFK was killed because he didn't want to be involved in Vietnam. Also note that until Reagan, there was such a thing as a conservative democrat. After Reagan they converted to the Republican party. They were mostly in the south ( I would hazard a guess that it had to do with the civil war and the carpetbaggers while a series of Republican presidents held the white house).
Caliban
5 / 5 (1) May 12, 2012
Massive debts are the bankers way of controlling economies and the population.

Governments control the bankers as they print the money.


As always, ryggsuckin' mouths the big lie.

Wake up, moron --the Federal Reserve(the ones printing all that inflationary money, secretly bailing out the brother banks, and giving them profit out the yingyang by loaning operating capital at ZERO PERCENT)-- is PRIVATELY HELD.

ryggesogn2
1 / 5 (4) May 12, 2012
Massive debts are the bankers way of controlling economies and the population.

Governments control the bankers as they print the money.


As always, ryggsuckin' mouths the big lie.

Wake up, moron --the Federal Reserve(the ones printing all that inflationary money, secretly bailing out the brother banks, and giving them profit out the yingyang by loaning operating capital at ZERO PERCENT)-- is PRIVATELY HELD.


Why must the US President approve the Chairman and why does the Federal Reserve have a .gov website address?

"The Federal Reserve System fulfills its public mission as an independent entity within government. It is not "owned" by anyone and is not a private, profit-making institution. "
http://www.federa...4986.htm

Do you trust the US govt Cali?
kaasinees
2 / 5 (4) May 12, 2012
How many people has communism saved because farmers didnt want to share their food in worse times?

This is what Capitalist america supports:

http://youtu.be/MnwI4m4KOlo
ryggesogn2
1 / 5 (4) May 12, 2012
How many people has communism saved because farmers didnt want to share their food in worse times?

Zero. The communists created the 'worse' times.
Zimbabwe had enought food to export before the communists redistributed the land.
You have never farmed have you?
kaasinees
2.3 / 5 (3) May 12, 2012
Zero. The communists created the 'worse' times.
Zimbabwe had enought food to export before the communists redistributed the land.
You have never farmed have you?

Neither have you. Also the communists did not control the weather, you delusional liar.

This is what Capitalist America supports(walls):
http://youtu.be/MnwI4m4KOlo
ryggesogn2
1 / 5 (2) May 12, 2012
Neither have you.

I started when I was 7 years old working on our family farm.

The communist govt in Cuba has just authorized those in the city to create gardens and sell the excess.
Communists know capitalism is needed to feed their people.
kaasinees
2.3 / 5 (3) May 12, 2012
I started when I was 7 years old working on our family farm.

The communist govt in Cuba has just authorized those in the city to create gardens and sell the excess.
Communists know capitalism is needed to feed their people.

How is that capitalism you douche? Thats socialism.
kaasinees
2 / 5 (4) May 12, 2012
A socialist economic system would consist of an organisation of production to directly satisfy economic demands and human needs, so that goods and services would be produced directly for use instead of for private profit driven by the accumulation of capital, and accounting would be based on physical quantities, a common physical magnitude, or a direct measure of labour-time.[5][6] Distribution of output would be based on the principle of individual contribution.

In a capitalistic case a privately owned business would collect all capital/goods from many people.
When people are allowed to grow their own foods and sell it that means equal distribution of food.

Cuba is becoming more social not capitalist.

in any case everyone in Cuba was secured with food. However in capitalist US more than 15% are insecure about having food on there tables. Disgusting USA.
kaasinees
2 / 5 (4) May 12, 2012
Since you are so against taxation read this:

Market socialism consists of publicly owned or cooperatively owned enterprises operating in a market economy. It is a system that utilises the market and monetary prices for the allocation and accounting of the means of production, thereby retaining the process of capital accumulation. The profit generated would be used to directly remunerate employees or finance public institutions.[36] In state-oriented forms of market socialism, in which state enterprises attempt to maximise profit, the profits can be used to fund government programs and services through a social dividend, eliminating or greatly diminishing the need for various forms of taxation that exist in capitalist systems.


You might love socialism if you opened your freaking head from capitalist indoctrination.
NotParker
1 / 5 (3) May 12, 2012

When people are allowed to grow their own foods and sell it that means equal distribution of food.


Russia used to have collective farms. Traditionally centrally planned they were usually failures. When individuals were allowed to have their own plots, they worked hardest on their own plots -- because they benefited from their own hard work.

kaasinees
1.8 / 5 (5) May 12, 2012
Capitalism does not equal individualism.
It simply cant, because you cant accumulate capital without screwing over other people. So this means that you get many people working for one person.

Individualism is socialism.
ryggesogn2
1 / 5 (3) May 12, 2012
Market socialism consists of publicly owned or cooperatively owned enterprises

These exist all over the country and world. Some are publicly held companies like GE and some are co-ops.
The key difference is they are NOT owned by the govt since the govt has the force to prevent competition.
Example of these are Freddie and Fannie and now General Motors. Also, via onerous regulations, the govt effectively owns companies and limits competition. This is what the meat packers did when they sponsored the creation of FDA. The intent was to shut down their competitors.
ryggesogn2
1 / 5 (3) May 12, 2012
Capitalism does not equal individualism.
It simply cant, because you cant accumulate capital without screwing over other people. So this means that you get many people working for one person.

Individualism is socialism.

Of course you can accumulate capital. One way is call an IPO. Companies sell stock and you are free to buy it, or not. No one is forced to buy the stock.
Venture capitalist have their own sources of capital and they decide if and when to invest. No one is forced.
Govts and businesses raise capital with bonds. No is force to buy them.
Only govts have the power to screw people over by printing money and plundering their wealth.
kaasinees
2 / 5 (4) May 12, 2012
Of course you can accumulate capital.


I am sorry but bonds and stocks are not capital, they are virtual capital at best. Unless you have a shares on physical stocks. But hardly are any capital of stocks or bonds physical capital.

Only govts have the power to screw people over by printing money and plundering their wealth.

No, Federal Reserve is a private entity and you have to go through congress first before the gov can ask for a new bond and print money and even than the feds can say NO.
ryggesogn2
1 / 5 (3) May 12, 2012
Capitalism enables individuals to persuade other individuals to invest capital in their business ventures.
Very individualistic.

"Europe is about to learn there is no Santa Claus.

The China Investment Corp., that nation's sovereign wealth fund, has stopped buying European government debt, concerned about the region's financial turmoil. "
"But Europe is about to learn what Great Britain's Margaret Thatcher once wisely observed about those living at the expense of others. At some point, others run out of money to contribute."
http://www.ocregi...ece.html
This is what happens when the govt destroys capital.
ryggesogn2
1 / 5 (3) May 12, 2012
I am sorry but bonds and stocks are not capital,

Yes they are.

Federal Reserve is a private entity

Not according to the Federal Reserve. They should kwo
ryggesogn2
1 / 5 (3) May 12, 2012
The US State Department states stocks and bonds ARE capital.

"How Corporations Raise Capital"
"Issuing Bonds. "
"Issuing Preferred Stock. "
"Selling Common Stock."
"Borrowing"
"Using profits"
http://economics....ital.htm
Vendicar_Decarian
3.7 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012
Then George Bush's government was responsible for the banking industry failures that magnified the collapse of the Republican sponsored housing bubble.

"Governments control the bankers" - RyggTard
Vendicar_Decarian
2.3 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012
RyggTard confuses the capital raised by selling a bond with the non-capital bond itself.

"The US State Department states stocks and bonds ARE capital." - RyggTard

It takes a rather spectacular idiot to confuse a sold item, with the money used to purchase it.

Libertarian RyggTard is such an idiot.

Vendicar_Decarian
2.3 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012

"Capitalism enables individuals to persuade other individuals to invest capital in their business ventures." - RyggTard

Which almost always fail.

If you like to gamble. Invest.

But you get better odds in Vegas.
Vendicar_Decarian
2.3 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012
And are now purchasing American banks.

Ahahahahahahaha..........

"The China Investment Corp., that nation's sovereign wealth fund, has stopped buying European government debt, concerned about the region's financial turmoil. "

Vendicar_Decarian
2.3 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012
RyggTard would rather not have people know that his reference is from "Orange County" a U.S. county Nestorius for bankrupting itself in 1994 through the Republican/Libertarian plan to use of county money to purchase "rare coins and postage stamps" that they hoped would appreciate in value.

That Republican plan failed of course. Just like all other Republican plans.

"But Europe is about to learn what Great Britain's Margaret Thatcher once wisely observed about those living at the expense of others. At some point, others run out of money to contribute." - RyggTard

Check out this link.

http://en.wikiped...lifornia
Vendicar_Decarian
2.3 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012
Orange County was at the time the largest US county to have gone bankrupt, when in 1994 longtime treasurer Robert Citron's investment strategies left the county with inadequate capital to allow for any raise in interest rates for its trading positions. When the conservative residents of Orange County voted down a proposal to raise taxes in order to balance the budget, bankruptcy followed soon after. Citron later pleaded guilty to six felonies regarding the matter.

Republican Orange County voted itself into bankruptcy. Just as Republicans in America have done to the entire country.
Vendicar_Decarian
2.3 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012
It is funny to see how spectacularly clueless pro-Capitalist Libertarians like RyggTard are regarding money in the Capitalist system.

RyggTard is blissfully ignorant of the fact that banks manufacture money every time it they make a loan.

Borrowed money comes from nowhere. The bank from which it is obtained, simply fabricates it out of thin air.

"Only govts have the power to screw people over by printing money and plundering their wealth." - RyggTard

It is this creation of money from nothing by banks is what required the creation of the fractional reserve system and the FED to oversee and regulate money creation.

Poor Ignorant RyggTard.
Vendicar_Decarian
2.3 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012
Ahahahaha... So in the Libertraian view of the universe, Da Gubderment owns the meat packing industry because it imposes health and safety standards on that industry.

Libertarians are morons.

"Also, via onerous regulations, the govt effectively owns companies and limits competition. This is what the meat packers did when they sponsored the creation of FDA. The intent was to shut down their competitors." - RyggTard
NotParker
1 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012
Orange County was at the time the largest US county to have gone bankrupt, when in 1994 longtime treasurer Robert Citron's investment strategies left the county with inadequate capital to allow for any raise in interest rates for its trading positions.


"Robert Lafee Citron (born 1925) is a Democratic Party politician who was the longtime Treasurer-Tax Collector of Orange County, California, when it declared Chapter 9 bankruptcy on December 6, 1994. Citron was the only Democrat to hold office in otherwise Conservative/Republican Orange County at the time. "

See ... electing Democrats is insane.
ryggesogn2
1 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012
Here is one area universities can cut costs:

"Many academics I know agree that black-studies programs are often slipshod, academically non-rigorous, and repositories for grievance politics. But they wont say so publicly, for fear of being branded as racists."
http://www.nation...hn-fund#
Vendicar_Decarian
2.3 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012
Robert Lafee Citron won re-election seven in that Republican County times; in his last election victory, his opponent, John Moorlach, charged that his handsome gains were the result of risky betting.

Citron was a product of the Republican County who repeatedly elected him - a Republican County that would rather bankrupt itself than raise taxes. Just as Nationally Republicans have bankrupted their nation by their borrow and spend tax policies.
Vendicar_Decarian
2.3 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012
Scratch a Libertarian expose a racist.

"Here is one area universities can cut costs:" Cut Black Studies - RyggTard
NotParker
1 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012
VD: Republican Orange County voted itself into bankruptcy.


"Robert Lafee Citron (born 1925) is a Democratic Party politician who was the longtime Treasurer-Tax Collector of Orange County, California, when it declared Chapter 9 bankruptcy on December 6, 1994. Citron was the only Democrat to hold office in otherwise Conservative/Republican Orange County at the time. "

Terriva
1 / 5 (2) May 13, 2012
You're like nest full of chickens, who feel squashed with their neighbours mutually. "It's because of YOU", says the white chicken to the black chicken. "Nope, it's because of YOU", insists the black chicken. "Nope, it's because you're both way too libertarian chicks", says the third one - and so on... Whereas the primary reason is, the hen is sitting on the nest.

Accordingly, the primary reason of the financial crisis is the energetic crisis, because of steadily increasing prices of oil. These prices are escalated with wars, which do consume huge amount of oil by itself. The lost Vietnam war initiated the oil crisis at the beginning of 70's, the Iraq war initiated the oil crisis at the end of 2009. Because one third of oil is consumed in agriculture, the price of oil escalates the price of food and so on. The only solution is therefore to decrease the price of energy. It cannot be done with technologies, which are increasing the price of raw materials - this just delays the solution.
Vendicar_Decarian
2.3 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012
Robert Lafee Citron won re-election seven times in that Republican County; in his last election victory, his opponent, John Moorlach, charged that his handsome gains were the result of risky betting.

Citron was a product of the Republican County who repeatedly elected him - a Republican County that would rather bankrupt itself than raise taxes. Just as Nationally Republicans have bankrupted their nation by their borrow and spend tax policies.
Vendicar_Decarian
2.3 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012
Just 2 years ago the Republican Mantra was "Drill baby Drill", with the Republicans roundly criticizing their own president for a short moratorium on drilling in the gulf in order to review and modify safety protocols in the wake of the massive oils spill there.

Republicans claimed that drilling for new oil was essential to lower the price of oil for Americans.

Now just 2 years later, Without an increase in oil production, America is now a net exporter of oil. and has had several refineries close due to lack of international demand.

Republican oil policy looks even more like idiocy than it did at the time.

U.S. gasoline imports have been dropping and exports rising since 2005.

http://energypoli...4204.jpg
Vendicar_Decarian
2.3 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012
Republicans and Libertarians are incapable of self governance.

Hence the ongoing destruction of their own country.

"Starve the beast of Democracy through national bankruptcy." = Libertarian/Republican promise.
Vendicar_Decarian
2.3 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012
One of RyggTard's compatriots has just been arrested....

Florida nabs white supremacists planning "race war"

Ten alleged members of a white supremacist group training near Orlando and Disney World for a "race war" have been rounded up in a series of arrests in central Florida, authorities said on Tuesday.

http://www.reuter...20120508
ryggesogn2
1 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012
steadily increasing prices of oil

When priced in dollars.
The price may be rising, but the cost is not.
This is caused by inflation.
Vendicar_Decarian
2 / 5 (4) May 13, 2012
What you get when you Vote Republican.

"A top aide to Florida Governor Rick Scott has resigned after a recent flurry of media reports focused on his alleged steering of state government contracts to longtime acquaintances or friends."

http://www.reuter...20120513
Vendicar_Decarian
2.3 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012
RyggTard's lie is easily exposed.

https://docs.goog...UQ3JjSG8

This is a LOG plot of oil prices in constant dollars. Prices have risen by a factor of 4 since the 90's and early 2,000's.

"When priced in dollars.
The price may be rising, but the cost is not." - RyggTard

Poor RyggTard. He doesn't live in the reality based community.
Vendicar_Decarian
2.3 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012
Correction to the link above.

https://docs.goog...HU250dnc

ryggesogn2
1 / 5 (1) May 16, 2012
How exactly has "communism" killed 100m people and starved people to death?


Here is how:

"Scholars Continue to Reveal Mao's Monstrosities : Asia: Exiled Chinese historians emerge with evidence of cannibalism and up to 80 million deaths under the Communist leader's regime."
"It is now believed that as many as 60 million to 80 million people may have died because of Mao's policies--making him responsible for more deaths than Adolf Hitler and Josef Stalin combined."
""The biggest problem for the Communist Party is they never learned how to treat human beings like human beings.""
http://articles.l...st-party

Vendicar_Decarian
2.3 / 5 (3) May 16, 2012
Does the fact that America has murdered over 30 million people make it more or less bad than Communism?

America isn't even a political ideology and it's state sponsored murder count is sky high.

And this doesn't even take into account RyggTard's dishonest 100 million number that includes deaths during WWII.

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