Climatic effects of a solar minimum

May 06, 2012

An abrupt cooling in Europe together with an increase in humidity and particularly in windiness coincided with a sustained reduction in solar activity 2800 years ago. Scientists from the German Research Centre for Geosciences GFZ in collaboration with Swedish and Dutch colleagues provide evidence for a direct solar-climate linkage on centennial timescales. Using the most modern methodological approach, they analysed sediments from Lake Meerfelder Maar, a maar lake in the Eifel/Germany, to determine annual variations in climate proxies and solar activity.

The study published online in Nature Geoscience reports the climatic change that occurred at the beginning of the pre-Roman Iron Age and demonstrates that especially the so-called Grand Minima of can affect in western Europe through changes in regional pattern. Around 2800 years ago, one of these Grand Solar Minima, the Homeric Minimum, caused a distinct climatic change in less than a decade in Western Europe.

The exceptional seasonally laminated sediments from the studied maar lake allow a precise dating even of short-term climate changes. The results show for a 200 year long period strongly increased springtime winds during a period of cool and wet climate in Europe. In combination with model studies they suggest a mechanism that can explain the relation between a weak sun and climate change. "The change and strengthening of the tropospheric wind systems likely is related to stratospheric processes which in turn are affected by the " explains Achim Brauer (GFZ), the initiator of the study. "This complex chain of processes thus acts as a positive feedback mechanism that could explain why assumingly too small variations in solar activity have caused regional climate changes."

Albeit those findings cannot be directly transferred to future projections because the current climate is additionally affected by anthropogenic forcing, they provide clear evidence for still poorly understood aspects of the climate system, emphasizes Achim Brauer. In particular, further investigations are required with a focus on the climatic consequences of changes in different wavelengths of the solar spectrum. Only when the mechanisms of solar-climate links are better understood a reliable estimate of the potential effects of the next Grand solar minimum in a world of anthropogenic will be possible. In this respect, well-dated annually laminated lake sediments are also in future of crucial importance for these studies.

Therefore, scientists from the German Research Centre for Geosciences (GFZ) and other institutions search for such archives around the world in order to to obtain a more accurate approach to the solar-climate relationship and the different regional responses.

Explore further: Six Nepalese dead, six missing in Everest avalanche

More information: Nature Geoscience, DOI 10.1038/NGEO1460

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User comments : 92

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MorituriMax
3.6 / 5 (14) May 06, 2012
Let the flaming commence, as it always does with these posts.

Can't we all be civil? Me included.
Parsec
4.4 / 5 (25) May 06, 2012
I don't mind people disagreeing with the scientific consensus so much. What I find most frustrating is that so much of the opinion on climate change is not about refuting the science, as it is from adherence to a political ideology. It is a politicians job to cherry pick data, ignore significant findings, and attack scientists character instead of the science when the data doesn't fit the conclusion that the ideology demands.

People will be people I guess. I just wish so many of them weren't so stupid.
ryggesogn2
2.7 / 5 (28) May 06, 2012
The sun affects earth's climate? Since when?
ubavontuba
1.8 / 5 (25) May 06, 2012
Starts with this:
I don't mind people disagreeing with the scientific consensus so much.


Ends with this:
I just wish so many of them weren't so stupid.


Can you say, "Closed mind."

RobPaulG
2.1 / 5 (25) May 06, 2012
Internet inventor Al Gore for President.

Just kidding, he is as retarded as Jones, Mann, Hansen and the other con men.
Burnerjack
3.7 / 5 (13) May 06, 2012
Parsec, that is why I think of AGW as a religion as opposed to a scientific debate. Hysteria has no place in true science. That being said, the growth industry of govenment funding states otherwise. Climate change or not, poisoning the air we breathe, the food we eat or the land we grow our food in is never a good idea.
jyro
2.6 / 5 (17) May 06, 2012
The ONLY constant in climate IS change. Since the forming of Earth billions of years ago the climate has constantly changed. To reshape Earth's society based on climate change is insanity.
Use fuels and chemicals as efficiently and safe as possible. Climate change will always be happening.
freethinking
2.6 / 5 (19) May 06, 2012
RobPaulG,

How about we do not use the word Retarded. Al Gore con artist, socialist, ignorant, etc. are valid. I have a real big issue with the word retarded and think it should be retired. As a conservative, I hate name calling, lets leave the hate and ignorance to the left.
Jitterbewegung
2 / 5 (8) May 06, 2012
The SP bookmakers are still offering 100 to 1 for a sea level rise of 1 meter for any date within your lifetime and 10 to 1 for a 100cm rise.

Does anyone want to make a not so quick buck?
NotParker
2.1 / 5 (21) May 06, 2012
Scary ... because ultraviolet has also recently dropped.

"However, SIM suggests that ultraviolet irradiance fell far more than expected between 2004 and 2007 by ten times as much as the total irradiance did while irradiance in certain visible and infrared wavelengths surprisingly increased, even as solar activity wound down overall."

http://wattsupwit...onstant/

We could be in for another grand minimum. For those of you under 20, the last 40 years or more of your life could be very, very cold.
StarGazer2011
2.2 / 5 (18) May 06, 2012
Good to see some actual climate science being done, rather than the typical postnormalist 'just so stories'. But I notice they still make the genuflection to the cult of CAGW. Oh well, baby steps. Intersting that the cooling happened over decadal scale, I wonder how fast the bounce back was?
unknownorgin
2.1 / 5 (11) May 06, 2012
This study adds to the growing proof that alarmist predictions about future climate change have little credibilty because we are still learning about the basics of what drives climate change.
gregor1
2.1 / 5 (14) May 06, 2012
I thought the science was settled. We can't let actual data spoil a good computer model.
Howhot
2.9 / 5 (10) May 07, 2012
All right, you DENIER degenerates! I want this place evacuated in 20 seconds! If you can't have a serious conversation about the total eco collapse of earth's bio systems from polluting polluters, then just make stuff up.

gregor1
1.6 / 5 (15) May 07, 2012

Name calling with caps lock now? I love your little hissy fits.
Howhot
2.7 / 5 (12) May 07, 2012
What? You think being called a DENIER is name calling? Oh please. You know it's the polluting polluters that are causing all of this. They would gag your mother for a buck.
GuruShabu
1.9 / 5 (18) May 07, 2012
GW is a religion as many other issues presently.
The Sun was always the main regulator of the weather in the Solar System.
However, there are big inter$t$ in the game and we are flooded by passionate media echoing the dodgy pseudo science throwing cooked data to the public.
In the history of the Earth we had higher values in mean temperature and sea levels than today but people still don't consider it because we are brain washed by the media.
The level of CO2 today is a little bit below 300ppm while we had recorded data that shows 7000 ppm of CO2 and no raise in the mean temperature of the planet.
But how can we reason with unreasonable believers?
In sum, it is another sad religion-fanaticism time based o believing than in sound-based science.
Howhot
2.5 / 5 (11) May 07, 2012
GW is a religion as many other issues presently.


Yeah, well if Anthropogenic Global Warming (a theory of why the world is getting warmer) is a religion, then call me Jerry Falwell! Send your money now! If you gullible enough to be a DENIER of such an extreme that you post on PhysOrg, you can send
me all you money. You won't miss it.

Kidding of course. It's just sad to read such ignorant commentary from the deniers when so much immediate action need to be taken to stop the polluting polluters from further damaging a very very thin atmosphere that all life depends on. All for the greedy gains of a few.

Isn't that right Koch boy?

A2G
1.7 / 5 (17) May 07, 2012
When I was a child I used to go to my grandfather's farm and find seashells. He told me that the ocean used to cover his farm long before the white man ever came to the US. He told me that the ocean has always gone up and down through the many eons that earth has been here.

I guess now my grandpa would be a denier.

BTW his farm was in Iowa.
GuruShabu
1.9 / 5 (17) May 07, 2012
Howhot boy,
You can call me anything but an ignorant.
I have a PhD and I have worked for NASA for 10 years.
What is your education level?
BTW, I also have a degree in meteorology.
Howhot
3.2 / 5 (11) May 07, 2012
I guess now my grandpa would be a denier.

No not at all. I've lived on farm in SW Kansas and wore a Cowboy hat. Punched a few cattle too. Funny part about KS, you could find Shark teeth in the lime stone burns. Shark teeth in the middle of KS.

Of course, it was covered in an ocean like 100million years ago. We are doing the same thing in 100 years that took 100 million years for nature to do. 100 FREAKING YEARS = 100 million natural years. That is not religion. That is the freaking truth!
A2G
1.7 / 5 (17) May 07, 2012
Howhot...notice that your rant contained not one FACT or any DATA.
Just name calling and words like "extreme" and "ignorant"

You basically just proved the point that GuruShabu made at the end of his post.

I won't deny that there is a problem with pollution and we need to focus on stopping the pollution we can actually do something about.

We cannot waste anymore time fighting an invisible non-existent dragon called AGW.

I don't know how many times I see simple posts with hard DATA and links to actual studies put down with zero facts and just a lot of name calling. Then you think it is not a religion?

It certainly could not be called science. Correlation does not prove causation is a cornerstone of science. Prove the causation and then you have a case. Until then it is just speculation.

But when you react like you just did, it is a religion to you.
A2G
1.7 / 5 (17) May 07, 2012
Hotbot...You are saying that KS will be underwater in 100 years?

Seriously? How in the world do you not think that is alarmist?

No one in their right minds thinks that. Even the IPCC which has been proven over and over to lie to prove their point doesn't come anywhere close to saying that.

What are you smoking?
GuruShabu
1.8 / 5 (19) May 07, 2012
A2G,
I totally agree with you.
I am absolutely committed to a clean environment.
Pollution and worst, over fishing are a real BIG problem but believing (that is the word) in Anthropogenic Climate Change is an absolute NO.
Cheers and thanks for the support because I am used to receive only "1s" ...:)
Howhot
2.5 / 5 (11) May 07, 2012
Well you a very learned man then Koch boy, and should know better than to side up with these AGW deniers. Facts are facts and figures are figures. Deniers just make crap up, anything to keep the debate seemingly in there favor. To bad. It's such a waste of time when it is becoming more apparent everyday the complete damage and destruction people have done to the environment and atmosphere by AGW. You know we fixed the Ozone hole by banning fluorocarbons; CO2 from fossils is probably worst because of linger time and the consequences it has on the food chain.
Once the CO2 cycle is thrown out of kilter, it could be permanent, or at a minimum, cause hardship for millions.

Fortunately we will run out of Oil by 2050 and coal will never be a substitute for oil for versatility or energy density. Natural gas won't last that long. With the collapse of oil, an over dependence on coal and natural gas, we only have to survive 200 year and the CO2 glut will be over. If we aren't dead first.
Howhot
3 / 5 (8) May 07, 2012
You are saying that KS will be underwater in 100 years?


Of course not. The point I was trying to make was that we have done in 100 years what it took nature millions of years to do; raise CO2 levels from 290ppm to 400ppm. It's a green house gas too; as nasty as they get. It is very good at trapping heat just like it does on Venus. The sun shines in but the heat doesn't leave. There radiative cooling with CO2 (and the other green house gasses).

The biggest source of all of that CO2 is Coal, Oil and Natural Gas. AVERAGE global temperatures have increased in lockstep with
the CO2 increases and will continue to do so. That is simple cause and effect. AGW theory has many testable predictive capabilities and the predictions are not looking good for the human race.

The acidity oceans of the world has increased in the past 100 years from a PH of 8.7 to 8.2 creating a concern that it could effect some critical plankton necessary for the entire food chain.
That is one example.
gregor1
1.9 / 5 (17) May 07, 2012
So howhot, name calling aside where are your facts and figures? If the evil 'deniers' make stuff up I see none of them here. All I see is a rather sad victim of groupthink who clearly shows his colors by name calling in lew of evidence. In fact name calling is a major sighn of groupthink
http://wattsupwit...upthink/

gregor1
1.8 / 5 (16) May 07, 2012
Sadly too, it's the environment that will suffer from the spread of disinformation by alarmists. It's the 'boy who cried wolf" syndrome. When real environmental issues arise they will be ignored because of previous unwarranted alarm. Climate 'scientists' rate slightly ahead of used car salesmen in the public imagination right now and the last thing they need is more false claims. Name calling friends are no help either. Howhot, you are "big oil's" best friend.
A2G
1.8 / 5 (19) May 07, 2012
Hotbot...Run out of oil by 2050? Where in the world do you come up with that? You can't just say things without backing it up.

Although my field of work is not in the oil sector, I work with people from the middle east who pump millions of barrels per day and they now have at least a 200 year supply at the current rate of production. BTW the increase is not from the US.

But try again. Next time find some actual FACTS to use. Not alarmist words that are unsubstantiated.

We true scientists do not fall for that. We look at facts. Not wild statements.
A2G
1.9 / 5 (18) May 07, 2012
Hotbot wrote..."The acidity oceans of the world has increased in the past 100 years from a PH of 8.7 to 8.2"

Total BS. Maybe you should look at some actual studies with real data. Then you will see how far off your numbers are.

You are the one in denial.
Vendicar_Decarian
5 / 5 (5) May 07, 2012
The IPCC estimates that increases changes in solar output can explain up to 20 percent of the warming seen since pre-industrial times. Current total solar irradiance has been observed to be slightly declining and causing the earth to minutely cool as the earth has been observed to be warming.

"The sun affects earth's climate? Since when?" = RyggTard

Poor Ignorant RyggTard. He is a classic Libertarian/Randite.
Vendicar_Decarian
4.3 / 5 (6) May 07, 2012
Over the past 150 years, the earth's oceans have become more acidic by 0.1 unit of pH, and the study's scientists predict that by 2100 there will be an increase to 0.2 or 0.3 pH.
Vendicar_Decarian
3.9 / 5 (7) May 07, 2012
2050 is about right.

"Run out of oil by 2050? Where in the world do you come up with that? You can't just say things without backing it up." - A2G

Assuming your 200 year figure is accurate - and it isn't - it is based on current consumption rates.

Oil consumption typically grows by about 2 to 3 percent per year.

A growth rate of 3 percent produces a doubling time of around 23 years. Which means that over the next 23 years more oil will be consumed in total than all of the oil consumed so far. Since we are at peak oil, this means that at a 3% growth rate, global oil reserves will be exhausted in 23 years or by 2035.

Assuming a 2 percent growth rate, the doubling period is 35 years and oil exhaustion occurs at year 2047.

Assuming that growth in oil consumption can be reduced to 1 percent, oil exhaustion occurs at year 2082.

Vendicar_Decarian
3.9 / 5 (7) May 07, 2012
http://climatecro...-change/

"Sadly too, it's the environment that will suffer from the spread of disinformation by alarmists." - GregorTard

Animals generally live in the moment and do what is required. It is human beings who have mastered the arts of living in the past, lying to ourselves, ignoring what our senses tell us, and hiding in the shadows of projection, compartmentalization, repression, and denial.
Vendicar_Decarian
4.4 / 5 (7) May 07, 2012
You must have missed the nonsense denialist claim that global warming is caused by the sun, or the moon, or mars, or trees, or anything but CO2, or that the earth is cooling etc.

All made up nonsense.

"If the evil 'deniers' make stuff up I see none of them here." - GregorTard

How did you miss it? Oh ya.. You have been spreading that manuer.
Vendicar_Decarian
4.3 / 5 (6) May 07, 2012
You must have missed the news Robbie....

"Internet inventor Al Gore for President." - RobPaulG

Former Veep Al Gore is now getting a bit of credit for his infamous 1999 claim that I took the initiative in creating the Internet: Hell be one of the first inductees into the Internet Hall of Fame.

The names were announced Monday at the Internet Societys Global INET 2012 conference in Geneva, Switzerland

The groups description of Gore states: Al Gore, the 45th Vice President of the United States, was a key proponent of sponsoring legislation that funded the expansion of and greater public access to the Internet. Instrumental in helping to create the Information Superhighway, Gore was one of the first government officials to recognize that the Internets impact could reach beyond academia to fuel educational and economic growth as well.
Vendicar_Decarian
4.3 / 5 (6) May 07, 2012
All of whom have been honored by their peers and received multiple awards for achievement and excellence over the years

"... he is as retarded as Jones, Mann, Hansen and the other con men." - RobPaulG

Other than his stinky diaper, RobPaulG has achieved nothing.
Vendicar_Decarian
4.4 / 5 (7) May 07, 2012
Which is why the hysteria that Conservatives show in opposing Global Warming Science is evidence that their mindless whining is not based on science.

"Hysteria has no place in true science" - BurnerJack

Well done boy.

The planet has a fever, and Republicans are the disease.
Vendicar_Decarian
4.5 / 5 (8) May 07, 2012
Poor Foofie. He doesn't realize that 100 cm = 1 m.

Clearly a result of an American education.

"The SP bookmakers are still offering 100 to 1 for a sea level rise of 1 meter for any date within your lifetime and 10 to 1 for a 100cm rise." - Foofie
Vendicar_Decarian
3.9 / 5 (7) May 07, 2012
Yup and death is part of life, so....

"The ONLY constant in climate IS change." - Jyro

by your logic there is no such thing as murder.

What is your address and real name?
Vendicar_Decarian
4.3 / 5 (6) May 07, 2012
From ParkerTard's own reference

If these SIM measurements indicate real solar variations, then it would mean you could expect a warmer surface during periods of low solar activity, the opposite of what climate models currently assume, said Gavin Schmidt, a climate modeling specialist at NASAs Goddard Institute for Space Studies in New York City.

It would also imply that the suns contribution to climate change over the last century or so might be even smaller than currently thought, suggesting that the human contribution to climate change may in turn be even larger than current estimates.

"Scary ... because ultraviolet has also recently dropped." - ParkerTard

Clearly Tard Boy is afraid that the science against his failed ideology is even greater.
Vendicar_Decarian
4.4 / 5 (7) May 07, 2012
And you are king of the martian mole people.

"I have a PhD and I have worked for NASA for 10 years." - GuruShabu

Really now? I have a PHD in pain and a masters in disaster.

http://www.youtub...gw-_Ym6s
Vendicar_Decarian
4.3 / 5 (6) May 07, 2012
It is. You just can't stomach the truth and refuse to accept it.

"I thought the science was settled." - GregorTard

Your confusion stems from the fact that you are spectacularly ignorant of science.

The spectacularly ignorant seldom realize how ignorant they are since they are spectacularly ignorant.

Poor Gregor.
Vendicar_Decarian
4.3 / 5 (6) May 07, 2012
Your father was wrong of course. Iowa has always been above sea level and the "sea shells" you found were not from the sea, but from fresh water bivalves similar to what is found in the Great Lakes today (or before the introduction of zebra muscles).

"When I was a child I used to go to my grandfather's farm and find seashells... BTW his farm was in Iowa." - A2G

There was an extension of the great lakes that extended into Iowa roughly 1 billion years ago however...

http://www.igsb.u...ft97.htm

Note that the first land plants did not evolve until around 450 million years ago.

ryggesogn2
1.3 / 5 (15) May 07, 2012
PH of 8.7 to 8.2

7 is neutral.
GT 7 is more base.
LT 7 is more acidic.
Vendicar_Decarian
4.3 / 5 (6) May 07, 2012
The PH of a solution is the negative log of the hydrogen Ion concentration.

"7 is neutral." - Ryggtard

Ocean water is somewhat alkaline.

Do you have a point Tard Boy?
rubberman
3.5 / 5 (11) May 07, 2012
Howhot boy,
You can call me anything but an ignorant.
I have a PhD and I have worked for NASA for 10 years.
What is your education level?
BTW, I also have a degree in meteorology.


You don't even know the correct current value for atmospheric PPM of Co2 (over 390). The title of the article and contents describe the effects of a solar minimum prior to anthropogenic forcings. Take the knowledge required for you to obtain your Phd and degree in meteorology and apply it to a climate system where the only additional variables to the natural cycles of the last million years are what we as a race have added to the equation. (That would be a 110 PPM increase in Co2 over the highest concentration nature could achieve in the last million years and a 30% reduction in the natural carbon sinks due land clearing to suit whatever needs we decided upon). Not discounting the sun as that would be just as stupid as discounting our effect. A NASA employed Phd should understand that....
la7dfa
5 / 5 (2) May 07, 2012
ryggesogn2
1 / 5 (8) May 07, 2012
From the high priest of AGW:

"The problem is we dont know what the climate is doing. We thought we knew 20 years ago. That led to some alarmist books mine included because it looked clear-cut, but it hasnt happened, Lovelock said.

The climate is doing its usual tricks. Theres nothing much really happening yet. We were supposed to be halfway toward a frying world now, he said."
http://blogs.tele...eligion/
Howhot
5 / 5 (4) May 07, 2012
R2. What matters are the facts!

"Global temperatures in March make coolest March since 1999 even with record-breaking warmth for U.S." NOAA

It's even worst than we thought. Everything is tracking the computer models worst case scenerios. That is cause for concern.
Vendicar_Decarian
3.4 / 5 (5) May 08, 2012
Odd that this year, and never before in recorded human history has there been a North American winter that never took place.

"The climate is doing its usual tricks." - RyggTard

Science is growing very good at predicting nature's tricks, and has concluded that the trick behind current trends is the addition of CO2 to the atmosphere by man.

Poor RyggTard. He will insist to his dying day that Global Warming doesn't politically exist.
ryggesogn2
1.4 / 5 (11) May 08, 2012
R2. What matters are the facts!

"Global temperatures in March make coolest March since 1999 even with record-breaking warmth for U.S." NOAA

It's even worst than we thought. Everything is tracking the computer models worst case scenerios. That is cause for concern.

Computer models are not facts.
"All models are wrong", Box.
gregor1
1.4 / 5 (10) May 08, 2012
According to this guy it's not even close to the best case scenario
http://joannenova...youtube/
kaasinees
2.2 / 5 (10) May 08, 2012
youtube.com/watch?v=OmpiuuBy-4s
NotParker
1 / 5 (8) May 08, 2012
Odd that this year, and never before in recorded human history has there been a North American winter that never took place.


March 2012 was fractionally warmer than March 1910 in the USA.

Globally it was the 18th warmest March.

All the blue on this map is cold. As much as -5C below normal.

http://www.ncdc.n...1203.gif
gregor1
1.7 / 5 (12) May 09, 2012
This study states
Abstract: Global temperatures measured since 2005 are incompatible with the IPCC model predictions made in 2007 by WG1 in AR4. All subsequent temperature data from 2006 to 2011 lies between 1 and 6 standard deviations below the model predictions. The data show with > 90% confidence level that the models have over-exaggerated global warming.
http://clivebest..../?p=3303
Vendicar_Decarian
3.7 / 5 (6) May 09, 2012
Here is a computer model

function applecount(int,int);

int64 AppleCount = 0;
int64 OtherCount = 0;

string t_string = "apple";

do
input_s i_string;
(i_string.trim).ucase;

select case (i_string)
case t_string
AppleCount plus= 1;
case "exit"
exit do
case else
OtherCount Plus= 1;
end select
loop

return(AppleCount,OtherCount)
end AppleCount

"Computer models are not facts." - RyggTard

Clearly the program returns facts.

RyggTard on the other hand has nothing but mindless ConservaTard rhetoric.
Vendicar_Decarian
4.2 / 5 (5) May 09, 2012
Gregor's reference isn't a study but a link to a blog written by a nobody named Clive Best.

"This study states" - GregorTard

Clive apparently thinks that 6 years of weather data makes a statistically significant climate trend.

It doesn't of course. You need 30 years or more of weather data to deduce a climate trend.

Poor Clive. He gets it wrong on the very first step.
Vendicar_Decarian
4 / 5 (4) May 09, 2012
Poor ParkerTard. He will never comprehend that climate change isn't measured by the month, but by periods over 30 years or more.

"March 2012 was fractionally warmer than March 1910 in the USA." - ParkerTard

He might as well try to argue that the average height of Americans is growing smaller because the last two people to walk through a particular doorway were below the average height.

It is completely mindless of course, but then ParkerTard's form of mental illness always is.

NotParker
1.4 / 5 (10) May 09, 2012

He might as well try to argue that the average height of Americans is growing smaller because the last two people to walk through a particular doorway were below the average height.


But if a cult believed that everyone who walked through that door was going to be 2cm taller every decade, and claimed we had to destroy our economy to save the world from tall people ... and short people kept coming through that door for 14 years ... smart people might consider a few years of tallness was the aberration.

One tall person out of the last 60 is a trend toward shortness.

NotParker
1 / 5 (8) May 09, 2012

He might as well try to argue that the average height of Americans is growing smaller because the last two people to walk through a particular doorway were below the average height.


But if a cult believed that everyone who walked through that door was going to be 2cm taller every decade, and claimed we had to destroy our economy to save the world from tall people ... and short people kept coming through that door for 14 years ... smart people might consider a few years of tallness was the aberration.

One tall person out of the last 60 is a trend toward shortness.



March in 2011,2010,2009 and 2008 averaged 6.5F colder than March 1910.
kaasinees
2.1 / 5 (11) May 09, 2012

March in 2011,2010,2009 and 2008 averaged 6.5F colder than March 1910.

http://youtu.be/r_qdETSYcDM
NotParker
1.4 / 5 (11) May 09, 2012

March in 2011,2010,2009 and 2008 averaged 6.5F colder than March 1910.


Did you know both February and March of 1878 was warmer than February and March of 2011 and 2012.

Feb 1878 0.364C
Mar 1878 0.322C

Feb 2011 0.259C
Mar 2011 0.322C

Feb 2012 0.194C
Mar 2012 0.305C

http://www.cru.ue...t3gl.txt
Sigh
5 / 5 (3) May 12, 2012
However, there are big inter$t$ in the game and we are flooded by passionate media echoing the dodgy pseudo science throwing cooked data to the public.

I have long wondered how the claim that the scientific conclusions follow the incentives fits with the Chinese and Indian governments' need to fuel industrial expansion with cheap coal. That should make them claim there is no global warming, and the scientists in those countries should follow that line. Especially Chinese scientists, who have more than monetary incentives. But I never heard of Indian and Chinese scientists being more likely to claim there is no warming. And those governments also don't deny warming. Instead they say countries that fueled their industrial growth with coal and have the highest per capita emissions should cut first and should cut most. Where does that leave the "scientists just say what pays best" argument?
gregor1
1.4 / 5 (10) May 13, 2012
China and India just say what pays best. They stand to totally cash in.
Sigh
5 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012
China and India just say what pays best. They stand to totally cash in.

How is that supposed to work? What pays best for them is to deny global warming and go all out for coal. China especially has lots of coal, and its government is very concerned about energy security. China can't militarily enforce access to Middle East oil. Both for security and cost, coal makes the most sense.
ryggesogn2
1.3 / 5 (12) May 13, 2012
China can't militarily enforce access to Middle East oil.

China is building a blue water navy, threatening their neighbors to drill for oil, and drilling for oil off the coast of the USA.
They can't burn coal in their millions of new cars.
NotParker
1 / 5 (9) May 13, 2012
China and India just say what pays best. They stand to totally cash in.

How is that supposed to work? What pays best for them is to deny global warming and go all out for coal.


The Kyoto policy has helped drive millions of jobs from Europe and the USA to China and India.

These jobs now use coal for power, instead of the cleaner mix of nuclear, gas etc in the Western Economies (morons).

China now use 3x as much coal as it did 2000. India's coal use has doubled since 2000.

China now produces more CO2 than the USA and Canada combined (not that I really care, but some pretend to).

I am quite convinced that Al Gore is a chinese agent who has worked so profitably to destroy the "Western Economies" (morons) and increase world CO2 production (which has helped food production).
kaasinees
2.3 / 5 (9) May 13, 2012
We get it you are a paid troll. Now STFU.
Vendicar_Decarian
3.7 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012
A rate of warming of 3'C per century produces a fractional rate of warming of .03'C per year in the long term trend line.

"March 2012 was fractionally warmer than March 1910 in the USA." - ParkerTard
Vendicar_Decarian
3.7 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012
The only people who claim that are mentally ill liars such as yourself.

"claimed we had to destroy our economy to save the world from tall people" - ParkerTard

You need to seek mental help.
NotParker
1 / 5 (7) May 13, 2012
A rate of warming of 3'C per century produces a fractional rate of warming of .03'C per year in the long term trend line.

The 2nd warmest August in the Southern Hemisphere was 1884.

The 3rd warmest December was 1881. (First was 1850, 2nd was 1977)

The 3rd warmest September was 1878.

The 5th warmest July was 1877.

The 2nd warmest June was 1873.

http://sunshineho...isphere/

There are trends and then there are really warm 1800s.

The Southern Hemisphere is barely warmer than it was in the 1800s.

It isn't "global".

Terriva
1 / 5 (7) May 13, 2012
IMO the solar minimum in the years 2002-2010 apparently slowed down the global warming and I presume the Svensmark's theory may be the most probable explanation. But we shouldn't overlook the fact, that whereas the temperature of atmosphere stagnated in the 2002-2010 period, the temperature of oceans had grown steadily, which had lead into the increasing difference between these two temperatures and deepened the heat content anomaly. It indicates, that the temperature of the ocean is driven with different mechanism, than the temperature of the atmosphere and it supports my theory of the dark matter induced global warming, generated with decay of radioactive elements in the marine water.
MandoZink
5 / 5 (1) May 13, 2012
Here's a nice little "change of weather" chart.
http://www.shawno...%207.jpg
Vendicar_Decarian
5 / 5 (1) May 13, 2012
GregorTard links to some yahoo videos by some guy named "David Evens".

Who is David Evans?

"According to this guy it's not even close to the best case scenario" - GregorTard

David Evans is a nobody who has misrepresented himself, it turns out.

David Evans lives in Australia and gained media attention after an article he wrote titled, No Smoking Hot Spot was published in The Australian in June, 2008.The article claims that climate change is not caused by C02 emissions because there is no evidence of "a hot spot about 10km up in the atmosphere over the tropics." Evan's claim has been thoroughly debunked by Tim Lambert, a computer scientist at the University of New South Wales.

According to his bio, Evans claims to be a 'Rocket Scientist' and one article claims that he is a 'Top Rocket Scientist.' While Evans background does show that he has a PhD in electrical engineering, there is no evidence that he was ever employed as a rocket scientist.

Source: Desmogblog (http://s.tt/19aH4)
Vendicar_Decarian
5 / 5 (2) May 13, 2012
More mindless stupidity from ParkerTard.

"The 2nd warmest August in the Southern Hemisphere was 1884." - ParkerTard

Climate trends aren't determined over months, but over decades.

His mental illness is growing more profound by the day.

Vendicar_Decarian
5 / 5 (2) May 13, 2012
Now how could that be true when the U.S. neither ratified or acted upon the Kyoto Protocol?

Meanwhile Republicans have been assisting in the offshoring of American jobs for the last three decades.

"The Kyoto policy has helped drive millions of jobs from Europe and the USA to China and India." - ParkerTard

ParkerTard's mental illness is growing more severe every day.

Get help boy. You need it.
NotParker
1 / 5 (7) May 13, 2012
The 2nd warmest August in the Southern Hemisphere was 1884

Climate trends aren't determined over months, but over decades.



And 14 decades ago was the 2nd warmest August.

Why does that make you foam at the mouth?
Vendicar_Decarian
5 / 5 (2) May 13, 2012
Poor ParkerTard just can't accept that his drivel on monthly temperatures is meaningless.

"Did you know both February and March of 1878 was warmer than February and March of 2011 and 2012." - ParkerTard

He dishonestly wishes to convey the idea that there has been no warming since 1878. When in fact...

http://www.woodfo...rom:1878

ParkerTard is mentally ill.
NotParker
1 / 5 (7) May 13, 2012
Now how could that be true when the U.S. neither ratified or acted upon the Kyoto Protocol?


Regional Greenhouse Gas Initiative is a direct result of Kyoto.

Governors in the Northeast signed an economic suicide pact designed to destroy jobs.

That is just one of many economic suicide pacts in the USA.

http://en.wikiped...itiative

Vendicar_Decarian
5 / 5 (2) May 13, 2012
Poor ParkerTard just can't accept that his drivel on monthly temperatures is meaningless.

"And 14 decades ago was the 2nd warmest August. " - ParkerTard

He dishonestly wishes to convey the idea that there has been no warming for 14 decades. When in fact...

http://www.woodfo...rom:1878

ParkerTard is mentally ill.
NotParker
1 / 5 (7) May 13, 2012

"Did you know both February and March of 1878 was warmer than February and March of 2011 and 2012."

He dishonestly wishes to convey the idea that there has been no warming since 1878. When in fact...



There has been warming and cooling and it is now cooler than 1878 for those months.

I'm not sure why Mr Verbal Diarrhea is so freaked out by facts.
Vendicar_Decarian
5 / 5 (2) May 13, 2012
And yet NewYork as an economic growth rate of 3.3 percent. Main 1.4 percent, Rhode Island 2 percent, Massachusetts 2.6 percent, while states like Republican Alaska 0.6 percent, Louisiana -1.6% etc.

And of course the Socialist state of Canada who also entered into that pact barely entered recession and has had a growing economy while the U.S. has been in a deep recession.

"Governors in the Northeast signed an economic suicide pact designed to destroy jobs." - ParkerTard

Poor ParkerTard. His facts just don't add up. In this case a "suicide economic pact" that resulted in strong economic growth.

He is a congenital liar and is mentally ill.

Vendicar_Decarian
5 / 5 (3) May 13, 2012
ParkerTard remarks that a tall person walked through a doorway back in 1878. Presumably that fact has some significance to him, although it has no significance to the upward trend in the height of the population.

Similarly his idiocy concerning warm days, weeks, months has no significance to global warming trends.

http://www.woodfo...rom:1878

"There has been warming and cooling and it is now cooler than 1878 for those months." - ParkerTard

Parker Tard is mentally ill.
NotParker
1 / 5 (7) May 13, 2012
ParkerTard remarks that a tall person walked through a doorway back in 1878.


Mentally people claim recent warming is unprecedented.

The data says it is in fact precedented.

The 2nd warmest August in the Southern Hemisphere was 1884.

The 3rd warmest December was 1881. (First was 1850, 2nd was 1977)

The 3rd warmest September was 1878.

The 5th warmest July was 1877.

The 2nd warmest June was 1873.

http://sunshineho...isphere/
NotParker
1 / 5 (8) May 13, 2012
And yet NewYork as an economic growth rate of 3.3 percent.



"Think of New York State and its 3,200 employer-entities (state, county, municipal, school districts, towns, villages, and public authorities) as the Titanic, steaming on its maiden voyage. Now think of the Empire States off-the-books debt as icebergs."

http://www.tgbbj....ult.aspx
Vendicar_Decarian
5 / 5 (2) May 13, 2012
Something like 15 of the 15 warmest years on record have occurred during the last 20 years.

Truly unprecedented warming.

"Mentally people claim recent warming is unprecedented." - ParkerTard

Parker Tard will now counter that the temperature in his ice box last Tuesday at 4pm was colder than at any other 4pm time in the ice box's history.

ParkerTard is mentally diseased. He needs psychiatric help.

NotParker
1 / 5 (7) May 13, 2012
Something like 15 of the 15 warmest years on record have occurred during the last 20 years.



Except for 1934 and 1921 and other years.

Examples:

https://sunshineh...9211.png

https://sunshineh...1921.png

Vendicar_Decarian
5 / 5 (2) May 13, 2012
ParkerTard posts a link from "The Greater Binghamton Business Journal"

Central New York's only business-to-business, multi-media, news-and-information company. - Circulation less than a few thousand.

"Think of New York State and its 3,200 employer-entities (state, county, municipal, school districts, towns, villages, and public authorities) as the Titanic, steaming on its maiden voyage." - ParkerTard

The article ParkerTard links to is about Retirement health care benefits.

Poor ParkerTard. He can't tell the difference between Retirement Health Care benefits and the Kyoto Protocol.

He is mentally diseased and needs to get psychiatric help.
Vendicar_Decarian
5 / 5 (2) May 13, 2012
Parker Tard's latest lie is easy to expose.

He dishonestly presents the temperature record of Alabama as if it represent global temperatures.

"Except for 1934 and 1921 and other years. " - ParkerTard

Parker Tard has a mental disease. He needs psychiatric help.

The global average surface temperature in 2011 was the ninth warmest since 1880, according to NASA scientists. The finding continues a trend in which nine of the 10 warmest years in the modern meteorological record have occurred since the year 2000.

http://www.nasa.g...mps.html
NotParker
1 / 5 (7) May 13, 2012
The data I supplied showing 17 states have warmer period in the far past came from the NOAA.

Large parts of the world are cooling. Many of the worlds thermometers are in cities and near airports. I concede that cities and airports are warming ... especially when the population triples.

NotParker
1 / 5 (7) May 13, 2012

The article ParkerTard links to is about Retirement health care benefits.


120 billion in unfunded pension liabilities in NYC alone.

"Over the next five years, tax-funded annual contributions to the New York State Teachers Retirement System (NYSTRS) will more than quadruple, while contributions to the New York State and Local Retirement System (NYSLRS) will more than double, according to estimates presented in this report. New York Citys budgeted pension costs, which already have increased tenfold in the past decade, will rise by at least 20 percent more in the next three years, according to the citys financial plan projections."

http://www.empire...0710.cfm

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