Aliens don't want to eat us, says former SETI director

I completely agree with her.

Any alien species that can pack their fridge for the journey to another solar system doesn't need to graze when it gets there (on a species that has the entirley wrong protein makeup and contains a lot of toxic stuff to them, to boot)

And having developed on another planet it is exceedingly unlikely that they could (or even would want to) subsist on this one. Too hot, too cold, too much radiation, likely stuff everywhere that is toxic to them, wrong atmospheric composition, wrong pressure, too much or too little gravity, and the list goes on and on... ...any one of which would be a show-stopper for colonization.
Conversely if any single one of their environmental parameters don't fit OUR physology we'd be no use as slaves - not to mention that a spacefaring species probably doesn't need any (what for?).

If there was such a thing as alien life forms who are capable of the traveling in their spaceships to earth through the interstellar and intergalactic space, their knowledge of our universe should be the thing that WE need to explore. It would then be imperative for us to extend the welcoming hand in friendship and to prevent anyone of humans who would show any form of fear and hostility to these travelers. They would possibly have the secrets of the universe available to them, where it would take humans thousands of years to find out these informations on our own.
I, for one, would be very willing to go out to greet them, and without fear, only hope.

Yes but what scientists fail to account for is other aliens/people in society that don't think the same as a properly adjusted scientist would... For example, we have lot's of advanced technologies as well, but still we have those random crazies that choose to abuse, rape, pillage, and experiment on animals, bugs, and even other humans, including unborn children, fetuses and directly manipulating genetics regardless of the high failure/death rate.

There is no reason to believe that simply because a single alien could make a long trip across space, that all aliens are good aliens, some, though very few will do bad things, just as in our own advanced society some of us turn out to be inherently evil from the bunch...

If and when we do have alien encounters (and if we are having them already) all visits will not be harmless, some proportion will be good but others will devastate life on earth, just as so many advanced earthlings have already devastated our own planet in the past.

I think that long before they attempted a landing on our planet, they would have 'scoped' the earth first for thousands of years to find out what bacteria and other possible harmful substances they might by the accident take into their bodies or enter into their spaceship.
We must assume that alien life forms on their ship have no trolls or cranks or criminal minds, but only the minds for pure science and discovery. I think that the way that they would treat us would depend on the way we treat them. Force would be met with force, and friendliness with the same.
It is also possible that they would use robotic probes to scope us better and safer for them.

"There is no reason to believe that simply because a single alien could make a long trip across space, that all aliens are good aliens...." - whocouldshebe -

There is old Russian saying that, "offer friendly hand, but always be ready for the hostility".
We must treat them as people, not monsters first. And then if they prove to be the monsters, we will turn into monsters also.

Don't assume anything when it comes to aliens. What if our signal reaches out to someone and they mistranslate it. It's entirely possible. Or what if they receive it and consider us a threat? Regardless of their technology it is highly conceivable that if we reached out and found aliens who in turn have not contacted anyone but have space travel could likely fear us, or worse. Another issue would be that of dying planets. Imagine one morning 5000 large alien crafts come into orbit and request to borrow our planet for a while. We would be obliged to let them, but what happens when they want to stay? or interbreeding(if possible). There are so many unknowns that no one can say for sure that they wont or will attack us. This is just as pointless as the God debate. We won't know til it happens.

I think aliens will come and solve all our problems.

There is old Russian saying that, "offer friendly hand, but always be ready for the hostility".

Naw some American wrote that.

Any species capable of interstellar travel would be sending entities specifically designed for the purpose. Why send organics? We should expect to meet machines, sent by machines. We should expect them to be here already, sitting in the outer system where it is quiet, collecting info.

Info - the most valuable commodity in the universe and the only reason for interstellar travel.

Tarter and all of you are making WAY to many assumptions. For all we know we are alone, or the universe could be filled with nothing but giant blob monsters the size of planets that wander around consuming planets.

There could be plasma monsters in our sun or subatomic energy lifeforms in interstellar space.

It could be a wave of nano-bots, engineered life that has long since escaped it's parent civilization and is moving out from it's origin at 99.9999% the speed of light consuming everything in it's path just to make more nanobots and launch them ever outward.

There could be an invisible bipedal alien sitting in your room right now observing you or you may not even exist in reality as the whole "universe" is just a complex holographic simulation with predefined parameters playing out in the mind of some massive entity the likes of which we could never imagine...time and 3d space all being an abstraction from whatever ultimate reality might be out there.

i would argue that the advanced nature of a spacefaring race, that they would have such a knowlege of genetics, that would not need mere androids but would be able to create a species of organic computers with abilities that cater to the needs of exploration through space or studying an alien culture.

Saying "If aliens were to come here it would be simply to explore" isn't much comfort when a curious alien is inserting probes into various orifices (or making new orifices) to further its explorations of my body.

It would not make sense for aliens to travel so far just for a meal. I doubt there is enough 'meat' on the Earth to replace the food it took to get them here.

popcorn vs peanuts. Who really knows?
I suspect that any lifeform that is able to breach interstellar space will have a plan. One item on that plan is the replacement of resources.
I, for one, would happily part with 40# of useless material currently located around my waist. But not an oz more!

Any alien species that can pack their fridge for the journey to another solar system doesn't need to graze when it gets there.

I'm not worried, but I don't agree entirely with this. Seems like the first trans-Atlantic voyagers were eager to stock up on local fare when they arrived in North America. Biological incompatability makes the point moot.
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While in theory a spacefaring race should be able to mine the asteroids for everything they need, I'm more worried about corporate efficency managers. If an alien version of You Know Who make their way here, they might decide to sack Earth just because the concentrated minerals and metals will improve their bottom line by 5%.
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It is also possible that they would use robotic probes to scope us better and safer for them.

They may already be here. Ever seen a T-4 bacteriophage?

Info - the most valuable commodity in the universe and the only reason for interstellar travel.

Not entirely, but what _could_ we offer to technologically advanced species? Art, for one. Paintings, music, literature. All of which technically qualifies as info, I suppose, since it can be rendered as such, but I have difficulty imagining that we would have much of technoligical interest to them. Their xenobiologists will have a field day. Maybe we should hope they are races of stamp and coin collectors.

@puffski: Old Russian Saying. When the foreigners arrive, shake with your left and cut of the hand that is offered... then cut off the head.

One rather obvious possibility is a test grounds. What if they want to try something which is too risky and dangerous to try within their own star system even, never mind on the planet?

For that, they don't even need to cross the interstellar space themselves, a radio or some other form of remote contact will do.

I think it was Arthur Clarke who first pointed it out - not all information is safe. The example he used was (transmitted between the stars on the radio link): "Ok kids, now that you have enough enriched uranium..." Adapting it to today's settings, how about: "Ok kids, now that you have Higgs, let's turn it into a monoid..."

Then, after some years waiting, just sit back and study the fascinating spectra emitted by the new nebula.

Whoever they would be and where from is of no importance; as long as they do not bore us to death.

rwinners, you may go first

I do not know how my reaction would be if they resemble those crabs that have invaded the waters of western Europe. I might back way slowly.
Or maybe I would ask to examine their warp drive.

I think aliens will come and solve all our problems.

- finitesolution -

If aliens know our problems, they could scream and run away. Best thing is for Communist system to take over all countries. That will see aliens giving approval and they will agree that we are civilised world.

If theres one thing SETI has shown us, its that technical civilizations are not OVERFLOWINGLY abundant in the galaxy. Interesting information for them might not be art, culture, etc, (all appealing to organs and emotions evolved by one species on one planet) but rather our specific developmental pathways that led us to where we are.

"Say, you had Atomic theory in the 3rd Century BC and this is the current state of your space program?"

I would imagine the sound of them slapping their fore-head equivalents.

That might be foreheads (plural).
We have weird on our own planet. I cannot forget article and pictures of teenage girls of 14 years. Beautiful girls, but with two heads and each head talks. Both heads lived and are growing up. The strange thing is that they do not know what they will do if each one falls in love. It is very sad.

I do not know how my reaction would be if they resemble those crabs that have invaded the waters of western Europe. I might back way slowly.
Or maybe I would ask to examine their warp drive.

No need. They have been massing, claws clacking, in the ocean depths for centuries. AND THEY ARE HUNGRY!

(laughing) We will use you for the baiting, rwinners, and after they are pinching your toes already, we will pull you out of the water and take the aliens to the Obama, or to the UN. They will tell us to take them to our leader. Obama is not my leader but that is mere technicality.

Physical interstellar travel is impractical. Seems more likely instructions would be received on how to build something (or run on a computer). We wouldn't need to understand, just be able to follow directions. Think of it as if you were clicking on that peculiar but enticing attachment you received in an email.

I do not know how my reaction would be if they resemble those crabs that have invaded the waters of western Europe. I might back way slowly.
Or maybe I would ask to examine their warp drive.

you mean red king crab? I think the best reaction would be to boil water...a lot of it....and melt up some butter.

f theres one thing SETI has shown us, its that technical civilizations are not OVERFLOWINGLY abundant in the galaxy.

I'm not sure we can conclude this at all.

1) If they use other stuff besides radiowaves for communication we won't see them (e.g. neutrinos...which would have the advantage of not being blocked by anything)
2) If they use directed communication we won't see them (and why WOULDN'T they?)
3) There is no reason to go to planets other than your own unless there is something you want. We have nothing they could possibly want (or, in the case of information, couldn't get without making themselves obvious). There is NOTHING in it for them at all by making contact.
4) Civilizations may evolve in other directions than (biologically) going places. We don't really knwo whether there isn't a common path civilizations tend to take.

etc., etc.

"Aliens don't want to eat us, says former SETI director"
No, they certainly won't. They would lob a couple hundred of antimatter warheads to sterilize the disease that is call religion on Earth, to make sure they don't have to go through the stupid and bloody divisions, impediments and contamination to progress of intelligences in the Universe. A 5,000,000,000 megaton equivalent should do it, to clean the nest completely out.

"Aliens don't want to eat us, says former SETI director"
No, they certainly won't. They would lob a couple hundred of antimatter warheads to sterilize the disease that is call religion on Earth, to make sure they don't have to go through the stupid and bloody divisions, impediments and contamination to progress of intelligences in the Universe. A 5,000,000,000 megaton equivalent should do it, to clean the nest completely out.

You might enjoy how aliens melt the earth in 'Forge of God'
http://en.wikiped...e_of_God

-Somebody asks one of the good aliens if they believe in god. 'We believe in punishment' was the reply.

2) If they use directed communication we won't see them (and why WOULDN'T they?)

Indeed. Broadcast communication is extremely wasteful. An advanced machine intelligence (which we will inevitably become) would be extremely frugal with energy expenditure.

The emergence of sentience may just be like a brief burst of radio static and then ... silence. The only thing we might be able to detect is waste heat signature at certain frequencies.

I once read a story about a scientist working in his laboratory on the special radio tuner in certain bandwidth. In the story, he had language translating device which he had invented and was using it for translating radio stations in different countries. As he was tuning into other stations, he stopped and listened very carefully to a noise in a language that he had never heard before. It sounded to him like two voices speaking to each other in strange language. He recorded the voices until the sounds ceased, and then he turned on his translator. After awhile, the translator began printing out the message into English that said, "In three sunrises we will invade the earth and destroy the vermin that live on it." To which the answer was, "Yes, we are ready with our weapons and our leader is ready to take over this planet when it is finished." After reading it, the scientist was frightened that a whole armada of aliens were going to kill everyone on earth. He picked up the phone, and

- cont'd -
that is when the cat jumped on the lab table and brushed against the tuner, moving it to another station. This so enraged the scientist that he strangled the cat and tried desperately to find the station again. But the voices remained silent.

I do not know how my reaction would be if they resemble those crabs that have invaded the waters of western Europe. I might back way slowly.
Or maybe I would ask to examine their warp drive.

you mean red king crab? I think the best reaction would be to boil water...a lot of it....and melt up some butter.

- jsdark -

I do not know if the new crab invading European waters is king crab type. I only know that it is very ugly. Uglier than most. Imagine such a crab as 7 foot tall and wanting to shake your hand. It is very bizarre thought.
But it might be that space travelers would be bizarre, maybe frightening to us. It also could be that they would think WE are ugly being bipedal and having a knob sticking up from our shoulders.
If space travelers look similar to us, we would accept them more likely. But they may be something different under artificial skin, as in "V". I will offer them some of my pampushki and my creme puffs. They cannot turn down such delicious food.

Hmmm, and is her "projection of the NEEDS" of a likely alien species any more logical and rational than her belief that Hawkin's beliefs are "projections of what we are like"?

Our whole concept of "need" is a human one.

An alien species could engage in the most barbaric, destructive activies without regard to their "need to do so".

A somewhat good example of her mistake would be the predator movies where the alien conducted hunts on Earth and did NOT take into consideration the effects or dangers it had on humans or Earth.

By the same token a species as advanced as she describes could very well NOT SEE US AS A SENTIENT species and therefore do tremendous damage, because we did not matter to them rather than because they had a need to fulfill.

That we humans would NATURALLY be seen as an intelligent species worthy of consideration is humorous really.

Even more humorous is that tech. advancement NATURALLY produces compassion or understanding of things different from you.

Clueless boobs! No alien life has ever been detected. So of course the SETI morons have detailed theories on the alien pysche. Rubbish. Thankfully these fools aren't getting any more of my tax money.

Seems more likely instructions would be received on how to build something (or run on a computer). We wouldn't need to understand, just be able to follow directions. Think of it as if you were clicking on that peculiar but enticing attachment you received in an email.

See my earlier post not too far above yours Alfie (the one about Higgs, monoid...of cabages and kings:-)

No alien life has ever been detected.

No? So who made that troll passing under the name of "VD" who spews forth all sorts of nonsense for them to study our reactions?

They would possibly have the secrets of the universe available to them, where it would take humans thousands of years to find out these informations on our own.
I, for one, would be very willing to go out to greet them, and without fear, only hope.

-And most of us would be glad to see you go ritchie. Do you think the aliens would think you were some sort of fuel like swamp gas? Do you think they might have such monumental dimwits as yourself on their motherworld? Perhaps they use them as fuel.

It also could be that they would think WE are ugly being bipedal and having a knob sticking up from our shoulders.

Every post of yours exudes dumbass like a leaking oil well in the gulf.

To which the answer was, "Yes, we are ready with our weapons and our leader is ready to take over this planet when it is finished." After reading it, the scientist was frightened that a whole armada of aliens were going to kill everyone on earth. He picked up the phone, and

called NASA to suggest they put microphones on mars rovers to listen in on glassy-headed martian conversations. Remember that one ritchie? Ha you sure are dumb.

Those glassy-headed martians you saw running around on mars remember ritchie? Except that, since you didnt understand camera angles, they must have been lying down instead of running around. Lack of air to breathe maybe.

Did you take those pictures off your website? No I dont want to look-

" To search expectantly for a radio signal from an extraterrestrial source is probably as culture bound a presumption as to search the galaxy for a good Italian restaurant."

the aliens have already made contact. they will visit you in your dreams tonight.

I would be more worried about the situation of an undeground ant colony vs some guys on an outing building a fire over their nest. Nothing personal, you know, just happened to like the place.

Or perhaps an enthomologist on a field trip putting a few ant lions inside the colony to study how the said ants deal with the devastation. That last idea sprang to mind thanks to a recent article here about our own scientists studying how bees deal with hornets (their most dangerous natural predators) introduced inside the hive. Hmmm, anyone recalls the still not quite explained Black Death pandemics just a few centuries back?

Editors!
That is not an ATA telescope but one from the VLA. The ATA is an abbreviation of Allen Telescope Array, not Alien.

It is important to remember that life as we know it is almost by definition, a competition. Among the human species, there are many who are content to sit in their comfortable chairs and wonder why we can't all just get along. But our leaders, the ones who move us forward are competitive, we as a species are competitive. Despite the environmentalist movement, we continue to increase our population to the detriment of every other species on this planet. I am not saying that is fundamentally wrong, just that it is true. I don't expect life from another planet to be any different. If we have something that is usefull they will take it. If we threaten their goals, they will try to destroy us. Just ask the native americans what happens when an outsider with superior technology shows up.

@Otto
I see that you cannot let go of this Richie and that you will continue to insist that I am he. There are about four possibilities that would describe your vexation and transference of the Richie persona to me.

1) You are seeking revenge of this man for some perceived wrong done to you.
2) You are very delusional and/or insane.
3) You are latent homosexual who seeks out this Richie to establish sexual relationship.
4) You cast aspersions to, and accuse anyone who aggressively posits an opinion that is different from your own. Your straw man continues to flood the threads and veers away from the topic.
You also have no toleration for new people unless they are trolls and cranks or pedophiles who are of no threat to you.

In another thread, you have chosen #3, so I can only assume that you have sexual preference for this Richie.

You are now spewing your lies about my nationality when you know nothing about me.
It may be time for you to admit that you have the aberration. Your Richie is probably reading your posts and laughing off his head at how you have chosen a new man for your hot pursuit.

Your Richie is probably reading your posts and laughing off his head at how you have chosen a new man for your hot pursuit.

From another thread; russkiy/Ritchie says:

Not plural Black Holes; only ONE very massive BH about the size of the universe due to ALL the BHs converging on each other and merging to form the one massive BH.

And we can recall not too long ago when Ritchieguy posited the same idea that black holes were somehow more attracted to each other than other objects with similar mass, and so would seek each other out across the void of space and against the expansion of the universe, ignoring all other mass objects, to join together in eternal harmony. How poetic.

What are the chances of 2 dumbasses of sufficient magnitude coming up with this same idiot idea?

Sorry Ritchie you have outed yourself. Have a nice day dumbass.

And I repeat yet again, that your boyfriend had an idea about Black Holes that were similar to my idea, but he did not continue on any farther. MY hypothesis of Big Bang differed from his a great deal just as MY hypothesis of AdimensionalTime/Space differed from Amrit Sorli. It is very evident that the OttoTard is missing this Richie person very much and hopes for me to be him. GhostofOddo must be desperate to convince everyone that I might be his Richie. I do not know Richie, but if he ever does show up again, I will tell him that OddoTard thinks me to be him. Very stupid, this GhostofOddo.

In the Nikodem Poplawski thread of Black Holes, the retarded GhostofOddo apparently disagrees with me that I had said that Gravitational energy is not energy, but is a Force because Gravity has no energy of its own. He then comes up with Graviton as a part of Gravitational Energy, and I had to provide the proof from the websites that Gravity is a Force only and has no motion or energy of its own, and that it CAUSES MOTION. And I gave the example of rubber ball that is Matter using its Energy to try to escape from gravitational pull. I do not think that GhostofOddo was able to understand that, because he then tried to change the subject to Electromagnetic force, which is different than Gravity. He attempted to fool people, but he was wrong. And he will continue to fool as many people as he can. Very sad.

He also does not seem to understand between fact and hypothesis. The Graviton is only hypothesis because it has never been found, while it is fact that Gravity is not an energy, but a Force, one of the 4 Forces in the universe. He will still insist on the ghostly Gravitons, but has not provided proof that Gravity is energy. He can ruin every thread just to follow me around and call me names. That is okay, I can take it.

Here is a strange post:

And I repeat yet again, that your boyfriend had an idea about Black Holes that were similar to my idea, but he did not continue on any farther. MY hypothesis of Big Bang differed from his a great deal ... I do not know Richie

So Ritchie are you aware of ritchies posts or not aware of ritchies posts? And tell us again how you think only gold can be cast in wax molds.

I was in that thread and read his post. Later, I PMed him to ask him to clarify a point he made, and he did that, but it was not what I expected. He also told me that he was going to have heart surgery. I have not heard from him since that time. Yes, gold can be cast with lost wax method.

GhostofOttotard appears to have big neurosis. I will try to find the name and description for such neurosis on the web. Pity that Ottotard seems to ignore the topic of this thread and wishes to concentrate on me and his boyfriend Richie

Hey russkiyRitchie

Yes, gold can be cast with lost wax method.

Nobody said anything about lost wax method. That was ritchies idea and you wouldn't have known that unless you are him.

You've outed yourself yet again you stupidass.

It is too bad that the GhostofRetardo is so certain that no one else in the whole world has any idea of how gold is made into castings by pouring the molten gold into a mold made of wax, except for his loverboy, Richie. I do hope that GhostofTardo and his Richie are reunited again soon so that Tardo can ask this Richie for the same sex marriage. This is obviously what GhostofTardo is looking for....his long lost Richie. Perhaps this Richie is as much a Tardo as the GhostofTardo, which means that they belong together to make the pair.

I hope you find your Richie. Keep searching.

"Any alien species that can pack their fridge for the journey to another solar system doesn't need to graze when it gets there (on a species that has the entirley wrong protein makeup and contains a lot of toxic stuff to them, to boot)" When a species sets out on a campaign of invasion, do they leave home empty, or don't they pack their fridge for the journey? And again what drives a species outside it's comfort zone on exploitative voyages if not the search for resources like living space or minerals... The most innocuous is the search for trading partners, and where the new civilization they meet is technologically behind the explorers then colonization commences... When the Mayflower boat left Europe what was she in search of?

When the Mayflower boat left Europe what was she in search of?

The people on the Mayflower knew a lot of things about where they are going:
- gravity would be the same
- plants would be edible (there would be food)
- there would be drinkable water without toxins
- radiation levels would be acceptable
- there would be no poisonous atmosphere
- the atmosphere would have the right pressure
- the atmosphere would have the right mix of gases at EXACTLY the right ratios
- ...

none of these are guaranteed to fit an alien (actually, virtually all of these are guaranteed NOT to fit an alien)

With aliens coming to another planet we're not talking about going 1-2 percent 'outside their comfort zone'. We're talking about something on the order of humans deciding to land on Jupiter to live on the surface without a suit. that just doesn't make sense.

When the Mayflower boat left Europe what was she in search of?

The people on the Mayflower knew a lot of things about where they are going:
- gravity would be the same
- plants would be edible (there would be food)
- there would be drinkable water without toxins
- radiation levels would be acceptable
- there would be no poisonous atmosphere
- the atmosphere would have the right pressure
- the atmosphere would have the right mix of gases at EXACTLY the right ratios

The people on the Mayflower knew many things. BUT, unless somebody has been lying to us about the real level of physics knowledge in 1620, they didn't even know about gravity, let alone that it would be the same...Newton wasn't even born until 1642. And toxins? That concept was still 'foreign'. Even the discoverer that air is a mixture of other gases was born a hundred years later, in 1742. As for the rest; how could they actually know ANY of it, since nobody had been sent ahead to find this out....cont

cont....Christopher Columbus didn't make any such measurements either, he just assumed "good place to refill the water barrels and trade with the natives (they'll know what's safe to eat)What's more, he thought he had found a new route to the east Indies and that that was where he was, sorry antialias, it's just not an accurate or even valid response to a question like that.

As for what the Mayflower passengers were after? The Freedom to practice their take on religion, without persecution. Religious reasons for aliens coming to earth. Now THAT would be a twist! =D
Best Regards, DH66

They knew all this implicitly. People had been to the new world before and they came back alive. They had found water to drink, food to eat and air to breathe. They hadn't reported floating off into space or being crushed to the ground.

That something is put in formulaic terms doesn't mean it didn't exist before that. Gravity existed before Newton came up with the formula. People knew about gravity implicitly (every time they dropped something). The people on the Mayflower never even needed to consider the possibility that these things were a problem. They had it very easy - compared to space travellers.

For aliens (or us going to other planets) that isn't the case. No other planet will have an even remotely comparable environment to Earth. Why should we expect aliens to be able to live here? Or even want to live here? Surely they grew up/adapted to a very different environment. What seems balmy to us must seem extremely hostile to them.