University hit by new climate leak ahead of talks

So, "Old emails" is the defense now? How is it that the AP knows these are old emails when they can't even figure out the content?

Perhaps they should make sure of the dates, before sounding so biased.

We are in an interglacial period and we have not reached its peak yet.
That means the planet is warming.

There are only three important questions:
1. Is human activity contributing to the warming process (i.e.
is it agravating it/speeding it up)?
2. Are we able to stop our contribution?
3. Can we remove whatever input we have already had on this
process?
The answers to these questions will, I suspect be as follows
1. Yes
2. Yes
3. No.
So we will have to live with a warming world until it starts to cool then, if we still exist we will have to live with a cooling climate.
That's life!
All the posturing is motivated by profit motives of those who may be forced to change for the benefit of all, about whom they don't give a damn. They will take their profit now and future generations can look after themselves as best they can.
That is the sole motivation of those who argue against the fact of climate change.
Life is a process of change and these idiots think they can defy it.

These emails appear to have been verified as authentic by multiple sources.

I've already seen a handfull of them in regard to the urban heat island effect that are going to make things rough on a few people. Well, strike that. Things should get rough for certain people, but they'll get cleared by a rigged investigation and nothing will happen to them. Oh well.

Link to the full zip file of emails is avialable at wattsupwiththat, just FYI. Notice how physorg never provides usefull links in their stories? They could link to the sources of all their stories and relevant studies, but oh well.

All the posturing is motivated by profit motives of those who may be forced to change for the benefit of all, about whom they don't give a damn. They will take their profit now and future generations can look after themselves as best they can.
That is the sole motivation of those who argue against the fact of climate change.

Is that so?

From what I've seen there weren't any emails past Nov 2009. So perhaps this is a re-leak, unless these are first-time-leaked old emails.

So, "Old emails" is the defense now? How is it that the AP knows these are old emails when they can't even figure out the content?

Perhaps they should make sure of the dates, before sounding so biased.

Well, they did quote their source for the information. As a news reporting organization, that's pretty standard stuff. So, if the source is wrong you can take it up with the source.

"So, "Old emails" is the defense now?" - Jipakak

Defense of what? Are you making any charges? Tard Boy?

Glacial periods end with an overshoot of warming followed by a punctuated slow decline into the next glacial period.

The peak of this warming occurred 12,000 years ago, and since then temperatures should be declining.

They had been doing so. Until the recent, unprecedented and ongoing spike in global temperatures.

Poor Ah-poo-poo. He just can't get anything right.

"We are in an interglacial period and we have not reached its peak yet." - Au-poopoo

Defense of what? Are you making any charges? Tard Boy?

Nope. No charges coming from me. Just seeing a strong defense from AP and UEA for some apparent reason...

You must be referring to the heat island effect that the BEST analysis has found to be inconsequential.

"I've already seen a handfull of them in regard to the urban heat island effect" - GSwift

Where the original emails stolen or were they actually leaked? That depends on how you want to spin it I guess. Also I thought the major issue was Mann's attempt to "hide the decline" that is where his tree ring proxies showed cooling in the late 20th century rather than warming. @vendicar calling people " tard boy" (I'm assuming it's short for retard. very un PC) does nothing to bolster your cause. It makes me think you are perhaps a schill for the oil companies whose real motive is to herd readers into their camp.

"Just seeing a strong defense from AP" - JaIpakak

No doubt you also see Elvis in your breakfast cereal and ghosts under your bed.

heat Island info
http://www.warwickhughes.com/

More heat island info

http://www.youtub...dCOsMgCw

http://www.youtub...Qts-8Cxo

From what I've seen there weren't any emails past Nov 2009. So perhaps this is a re-leak, unless these are first-time-leaked old emails.

from the article "Instead, the statement said that the emails appeared to have been stolen two years ago and held back until now "

Don't expect denialists to actually read the article. They are simply attracted by the title, and often employed to lie to the public in this public forum.

Leaks that risk war and people's lives are cheered by the 'liberals'.
Why aren't these leaks cheered by 'liberals'?

The BEST agrugment against CAGW is the lack of corellation between CO2 and Temperature since 1998.

The BEST agrugment against CAGW is the lack of corellation between CO2 and Temperature since 1998.

1998 is an outlier. Do you know what the word "outlier" means? If you don't know the meaning of that word, you are not qualified to talk of any "correlation": you need to take remedial introductory statistics, pronto.

Now, aside from this classic and erroneous talking point of the paid shills, perhaps you'd care to peruse the charts of global average temperatures to date:

http://data.giss..../graphs/

Or, perhaps take a look at ocean heat content:

http://www.nodc.n...CONTENT/

Now consider that all of that is happening DESPITE various natural cycles like PDO, AMO, solar cycle, etc. None of those have somehow stopped over the last 60 years. Nor is the basic physics of radiative and convective heat transport through the atmosphere in question.

So the only real "agrugment" (sic) here is whether you're a paid shill, or just a tool for paid shills.

"Leaks that risk war and people's lives are cheered by the 'liberals'." - RyggTard

Unlike Libertarians, Randites, and Conservatives, Liberals generally cheer the exposure of unstated truth.

There is no unstated truth to expose her.

Conservatives, Randites and Libertarians cheer the suppression of the truth.

If there is some truth to be had here, then why aren't you crying over the latest email release?

"The BEST agrugment against CAGW is the lack of corellation between CO2 and Temperature since 1998." - StarTard

The BEST science purchased by the Denialist Koch Brothers shows a 0.14'C rise in average global temperatures over the last decade.

But what makes you think that there should be any correlation in global temperatures and CO2 levels on the time scale of a decade?

Elementary grade school statistics tells us not to expect one.

Given that you don't know this, I can only presume that you flunked out of public school.

"1998 is an outlier. Do you know what the word "outlier" means?" - Pink Elephant

He doesn't know.
He doesn't care.

He is blissful in his willful ignorance.

http://www.youtub...9SNzxJJA

Lies, damn lies and statistics I suppose leads to a mangled version of JG's assertion.

If you repeat a statistic often enough then people will eventually come to believe it.

1998 is an outlier

of course because you say so. go ahead keep repeating it.

basic physics of radiative and convective heat transport through the atmosphere in question

oh, you must be talking about water vapour or did you need to revise the physics.

"of course because you say so. go ahead keep repeating it." - BlueTard

It is easy enough to check. All you have to do to check is move to 1997 or 1999 and use the same methods to determine the "trend".

If it is substantially different then the point is an outlier.

You can find the data here. Near the end.

http://www.youtub...7z-0oo6o

Get back to us with your results.

You are capable of simple arithmetic aren't you?

You are capable of simple arithmetic aren't you?

If I try hard Vendi!

and thanks I finally join the 'tard' club. I worked hard to join.

PS: my stuff uses 300watts just being on standby. me bad.

You can find the data here. Near the end.

Got it. I like references. Hard to disagree now.

"and thanks I finally join the 'tard' club. I worked hard to join." - BlueTard

"As I have repeatedly said, Tards are what Tards do.

"my stuff uses 300watts just being on standby" - BlueTard

Why? Perhaps you like flushing your money and your children's future down the toilet.

of course because you say so. go ahead keep repeating it.

Apparently you disagree. Please explain the basis for your disagreement.

1998 saw an El Nino like we haven't seen before or since. That's not just some "statistic"; it's a well-known and undisputed fact.

And yes, it does bear repetition, because lately I see this 1998 canard surface on these threads over and over again. As if someone were strenuously trying to "keep repeating it". If you're in on that game, perhaps you could help explain this particular zombie's miraculous resurrection.

I still haven't seen any numbers from BlueTard.

And here I was believing him when he said he could perform basic arithmetic.

I guess I was wrong to believe him.

And still no numbers from the Blue Tard.

Division and subtraction apparently elude him.

In the next 12 to 18 months with a few more low temps recorded then the evidence will show that the earth is cooling. And that the biggest lie is the so clearly biased view presented by misinterpreted data propagated by videos such as 'crock of the week'. Let me see now .. 1 idiot 1 fool 1 stupid video presenter = 3 brainless morons. Did I get it right?

.. but the manufacturers make stuff with standby operation. Most equipment doesn't even have an off switch! Think of all the thermal energy added to the environment by me having to unplug electrical wall sockets after each use! Anyway my smaller air-con has an 'energy save' mode that I use often and that operates at only a tiny 1.7kW, so you see I am very environmentally conscious and doing my part to help save the planet.

Even more, I help advance bio-diversity by wearing cotton shorts, cotton socks and cotton shirts in a different color each day. I am pleased to support cotton farmers growing various color varieties.

So don't doubt my ecological integrity.

Like many responsible people I too am concerned about global warming so I leave my refrigerator door open slightly all the time to help cool the atmosphere.

I bet you never even thought of that did you. Huh, some scienceistic person you turned out to be.

And still no numbers from the Blue Tard.

Division and subtraction apparently elude him.

What a sad, sad state of affairs.

But good may result if this disclosure finally forces the leaders of nations and scientific organizations to admit their total powerlessness over the explosive forces [1,2] that sustain life as an evolving process in a climate that continuously changes as the Sun itself evolves.

1. "Living with the Stormy Star", National Geographic Magazine (July 2004) http://ngm.nation...dex.html

2. "Our Explosive Sun", in press (2011)
http://curry.eas....taFe.pdf

(AP) -- The British university whose STOLEN emails caused a global climate science controversy in 2009 . . .

AP: Please document that the emails were stolen or withdraw this obviously unfounded statement.

Division AND subtraction! You said simple arithmetic. I hope you only want me to do whole numbers. Fractions and decibels is very complicated.

The FSM mumbled something about standard deviation, baselines, not selectively excluding data from samples. I think the FSM means that you are cherry picking the data. Then again, how would I know when the information is restricted by researchers (avoiding FOI requests, stonewalling) or deliberate falsification to confuse critics etc as outlined in the emails.

As you say 'Tards are what Tards do' and applies very much to the pseudo-scientists at Uni East Anglia and other alarmist cretins.

That is not to say that climate change or AGW is not happening. Just that running around shouting that the sky is falling when in all likelihood there is nothing we can do about it, just propagates fear and alarm. Can we at least enjoy our final few decades without the misery.

The kids can re-locate to Siberia, where in a few decades the best tropical beaches will be found.

(AP) -- The British university whose STOLEN emails caused a global climate science controversy in 2009 . . .

AP: Please document that the emails were stolen or withdraw this obviously unfounded statement.

I assume you are attempting to make a distinction between a "leak" and theft. No such distinction would be necessary in any case.

All large organizations, as I'm sure you know, have policies on internal use of emails. While there could potentially be one such policy that says "use all our emails as you wish", I'm not holding my breath waiting for one.

Rather, any use of internal emails outside the organization would be considered theft from the organization's point of view, and without appropriate senior-level approval it would be perfectly customary to refer to it as such.

For the emails to have been stolen then theft must occur. Theft requires an unlawful activity to occur in such a way as to constitute a crime. No crime has been proven, therefore the emails have not been stolen. The statement in question is not only inaccurate but a shameful attempt at public opinion manipulation. It should be withdrawn.

"What a sad, sad state of affairs." - OmaTard

Are you referring to your ongoing criminal trial Tard Boy?

"For the emails to have been stolen then theft must occur. Theft requires an unlawful activity to occur in such a way as to constitute a crime. No crime has been proven, therefore the emails have not been stolen." - BlueTard

The concept of "Theft" as applied to information is inappropriate. The crime that occurred was the hacking into the CRU email server, the unlawful accessing of information there, the duplication of that information on a Russian Email server, and the subsequent hacking into the servers run by Real Climate, and the deposit of the copied information on that server as well.

With the latest release of private Emails on a Russian server, at least 6 British crimes have therefore been committed.

The reason is self evident. The Denialist conspirators were losing the PR war with the Koch Brothers funding an analysis (BEST) that strongly confirms the scientific results of the IPCC, NOAA, NASA, CRU, among others.

The results of BEST were a PR disaster for the Denialists

And there is still no numbers from BlueTard, even after the source of data was presented to him.

All he need do is read some numbers from a chart, and do a little subtraction and then division.

Laughably, he doesn't have the intellectual capacity to do the work that any grade 9 year old can do.

"Division AND subtraction! You said simple arithmetic" - BlueTard

I suggest you wait until school is out, find a 9 year old walking down the street and borrow their calculator. Give then a nickle and have them show you how to use one. Then press the subtraction key and division key in the proper order.

We await your results.

You can find the data here. Near the end.

http://www.youtub...7z-0oo6o

"I think the FSM means that you are cherry picking the data. " - BlueTard

It is easy enough to check. All you have to do to check is move to 1997 or 1999 and use the same methods to determine the "trend".

If it is substantially different then the point is an outlier.

You can find the data here. Near the end.

http://www.youtub...7z-0oo6o

Get back to us with your results.

You are capable of simple arithmetic aren't you?

You are capable of simple arithmetic aren't you?

Demonstrating simple arithmetic for your amusement is kinda distracting when I have a difficult decision to make. Its cold tonight and I'm not sure if I should leave my 2kW wall mounted bathroom heater on all night just in case I need a nocturnal visit. Perhaps if I leave the 3.5kW lounge room air-con on reverse cycle heating but low fan and the downstairs door open instead.

Which would be less efficient? Can you help me with the math if i give you the space volume, air flow rates and whatever data you need, so as to maintain a slightly toasty 27C. That way I can walk around naked like a big shot and the dancing girls won't get a chill in sensitive places.

Crikey, priorities matey.

Talking about crimes! I filled the spa with hot water and its been blowing bubbles for hours. Now I gotta empty it and no-one wanted to use it tonight. Some people got no appreciation of the environmental impact on vegetation by draining a spa lacking nutrients from washed off dead skin cells. Ignorance knows no bounds.

See the Ludic Fallacy. Smoothly consistent reality is the exception.

Santo fumo! 2 KW in the b'room! At N45 I've got only 500 W b'room cycling and 8 KW total.

Refrigerants are ineffective near 0°C.

For the emails to have been stolen then theft must occur. Theft requires an unlawful activity to occur in such a way as to constitute a crime. No crime has been proven, therefore the emails have not been stolen. The statement in question is not only inaccurate but a shameful attempt at public opinion manipulation. It should be withdrawn.

Your logic is faulty my friend. You are equating "theft" and "crimes" with public knowledge of such. Most organizations aren't going to go to great lengths to file charges, use DA and police time and money, to prove something was stolen in a non-high security facility. The term theft is entirely appropriate usage here.

Theft has an established definition and its not up to you to re-define the word 'theft'. Without a provable crime (theft) then it's not stolen. It's not about being appropriate or about public 'knowledge', its just plainly incorrect usage of the word and has been used in the article to sway opinion on an emotional level. Go ahead check a dictionary.

"As you say 'Tards are what Tards do' and applies very much to the pseudo-scientists at Uni East Anglia and other alarmist cretins." BlueTard

Given that 98% of all scientists strongly disagree with your quack tard assertions, I suppose to you that means that 98 percent of all scientists are cretins.

Does that include the BEST team employed by the Criminal Koch Brothers to debunk UAE research and found themselves claiming that their work represents "excellent science"?

And still you have provided no numbers.

You can't add, you can't divide, but you just know for sure that all 98% of the worlds scientists just have it all wrong.

Idiot.

"Talking about crimes! I filled the spa with hot water and its been blowing bubbles for hours. - BlueTard

You could have learned how to perform long division in that time.

Idiot.

"Demonstrating simple arithmetic for your amusement is kinda distracting when I have a difficult decision to make." - BlueTard

Dog ate your homework? Innumerate Tard Boy.

You have already demonstrated that you are intellectually inferior to a 9 year old.

That is typical for Warming Denialists.

Theft has an established definition and its not up to you to re-define the word 'theft'. Without a provable crime (theft) then it's not stolen. It's not about being appropriate or about public 'knowledge', its just plainly incorrect usage of the word and has been used in the article to sway opinion on an emotional level. Go ahead check a dictionary.

I think that what is being missed here is that certain kinds of "theft" are protected by whistle-blowing laws, in the public interest. Or were, until recently.

Regardless of the dictionary definition, if you take something that is not yours without permission, whether it can be proven or not, it is theft. It is your karma, which will follow you "as the cart follows the ox."

Of course, if there is a higher purpose involved, such as whistle-blowing, then that is your karma too.

What a sad, sad state of affairs.

But good may result if this disclosure finally forces the leaders of nations and scientific organizations to admit their total powerlessness over the explosive forces [1,2] that sustain life as an evolving process in a climate that continuously changes as the Sun itself evolves.

1. "Living with the Stormy Star", National Geographic Magazine (July 2004) http://ngm.nation...dex.html

Other parts of the story will be told in the latest update on "The Deep Roots of the Climate Scandal (1971-2011)"

http://dl.dropbox...reer.pdf

Until workable hyperlinks are added to the revised pdf file, I can send a Word.doc file of the document on request to omatumr@yahoo.com

Additional information has been posted on another news story: www.physorg.com/n...ase.html

With kind regards,
Oliver K. Manuel
http://myprofile....anuelo09

See: www.physorg.com/n...ate.html

China, the world's top greenhouse gas emitter, said Tuesday it will push at next week's climate talks for an extension of the Kyoto Protocol, which requires rich nations to reduce their emissions.

The concealed agenda of AGW: Equalize the standard of living in all parts of a new one-world government.

Today, many of us are only now starting to grasp that world leaders have an agenda that is independent of the will of their citizens.

http://noconsensu...ate-2-0/

Oliver

BlueTard & Vendicar_Decarian are in LOVE!

"BlueTard & Vendicar_Decarian are in LOVE!" - AstroOptics

BlueTard lusts after not only my mind, but my body as well.

Meanwhile OmaTard - upon hearing that BlueTard can't perform basic arithmetic, is hoping that he really is 9 years old so that they can become "special friends" as OmaTard has years of experience in anally buggering his own four children.

First thing in the morning and I face a day of explaining a shit load of flow rate data anomalies (oops - outliers) while only having the math skills of a preschooler. In the meantime I'm apparently lusting after Vendi and at risk from sexual assault by Omatumr.

Not a very happy way to start the day.

Oliver, do you not know of phase 2 of the plan? see kissinger and nixon knew about neutron repulsion and it being the main source of the suns and the universes power but chairman mao did not. as the world all followed their lead in the conspiracy they said it was to prevent nuclear war. however under the guise of that the united states had different reasons. as the climatoligists/scientists destroy our economy and power while funneling money to third world nations for supportung the scam the chinese will soon grow too strong and overpopulated for anyone but the us to even have a chance of stopping the chinese from taking over the world, at that moment neutron repulsion will be officially "discovered" and cheap easy neutron repulsion energy will be used both to power production of weapons and supplies and as weapons of mass destruction themselves in neutron repulsion bombs. saving the united states and allowing us to finally take over the whole world without looking like the bad guys...

Link correction to updated version:

"Fear-Based Climate Scandal Caused Society's Demise"

http://dl.dropbox...oots.pdf

http://dl.dropbox...oots.doc

I just read that a 19 year old male was arrested for posting nude photos of his girlfriend on the internet. Apparently the girl was under 18. If convicted he will have to register has a sex offender.

Without a provable crime (theft) then it's not stolen.

cool, so i can go take your car and as long as you cant prove its stolen no crime has occurred because nothing was stolen?

I can make an allegation that you have taken my car without permission. The allegation is then investigated. The allegation if supported by evidence is then presented to a court. If the allegation is proven (true) then (and only then) is a crime said to have been committed.

In the case of the emails, it is alleged that they have been acquired without the owners permission. The authorities are investigating. No crime has been proven and they have not yet been proven stolen.

Can I have my car back now, please?

I would say that someone who was at your house said i could borrow your car, not sure who, but someone.

Was she wearing a red silk night dress and looking very tired and mumbled about faces on Mars? One bottle of Champagne and Pirouette gets careless! Just put the top up and park it, I will need it tomorrow to get to work. From each according to his ability, to each according to his need.

dang it, blue. . . .what're y'all doing with my ol' lady in her red silk night dress when she's supposed to be at home? And I only had a coupla beers, is all.
dayum. . .can't trust nobody nohow

"Apparently the girl was under 18. If convicted he will have to register has a sex offender." - RyggTard

Given the childishness of your posts, I have long suspected that you were under 18. Did you turn your boyfriend in?

"First thing in the morning and I face a day of explaining a shit load of flow rate data anomalies (oops - outliers) while only having the math skills of a preschooler" - BlueTard

Life is hard, and then you die.

We are still waiting for you to perform a couple of subtractions and a division.

It has been over a week and you still haven't managed to complete the task.

Life is hard, and then you die

I guess it would be if you live in constant fear.

The youtube link video you posted does not contain enough data to do any math. Much better are Pink Elephants links. In any case it seems that you can interpret the data to fit your desired conclusion. The GISS data for example has an uncertainty of near 50% of the mean surface temp rise. Not much integrity in such noisy data. The US mean temp looks like its on a downward trend.

In any case, exactly how do these stats prove that human activity is a significant contributing factor. Oh, that's right - they don't.

Vendi, is that supposed to be re-assuring? I would laugh except you look heavily armed. Kinda reminds me of something I would expect from a terrorist group.

Theft has an established definition and its not up to you to re-define the word 'theft'. Without a provable crime (theft) then it's not stolen. It's not about being appropriate or about public 'knowledge', its just plainly incorrect usage of the word and has been used in the article to sway opinion on an emotional level. Go ahead check a dictionary.

Pretty sure you made my point precisely. The definition of theft is quite independent of whether or not YOU say it is theft. That WAS the point. The SOURCE of the information SAYS IT WAS THEFT. The fact that you don't like the source, or their claim, really is quite besides the point. Until they grant you access to the facility so you can use your primo investigative powers to solve this crime of the century, I think most of us will just be OK using the term theft. Thanks for playing. Try again!

The definition of theft is quite independent of whether or not YOU say it is theft. That WAS the point. The SOURCE of the information SAYS IT WAS THEFT.

Nerdyguy, please read this repeatedly until you realize what is wrong with it. You are unfit to have a conversation here without understanding what is wrong with your statement.

Just in case you are at a total loss, follow bluehigh's advice.

Go ahead check a dictionary.

The definition of theft is quite independent of whether or not YOU say it is theft. That WAS the point. The SOURCE of the information SAYS IT WAS THEFT.

Nerdyguy, please read this repeatedly until you realize what is wrong with it. You are unfit to have a conversation here without understanding what is wrong with your statement.

Just in case you are at a total loss, follow bluehigh's advice.

Go ahead check a dictionary.

Herbert, here's an idea. Stick to the topic. Use a logical argument, and present it well. Try not to get too off-track with your senseless rants at every person who has ever argued against you. It's funny as hell that you've gone through every place I've posted this weekend and written something similar to: "haha, you are wrong, you don't get it". wtf dude, are you 8 or something? My kids do a better job of public discourse.