Mexico acknowledges 2nd Mayan reference to 2012
November 25, 2011 By MARK STEVENSON , Associated Press
Mexico's archaeology institute downplays theories that the ancient Mayas predicted some sort of apocalypse would occur in 2012, but on Thursday it acknowledged that a second reference to the date exists on a carved fragment found at a southern Mexico ruin site.
Most experts had cited only one surviving reference to the date in Mayan glyphs, a stone tablet from the Tortuguero site in the Gulf coast state of Tabasco.
But the National Institute of Anthropology and History said in a statement that there is in fact another apparent reference to the date at the nearby Comalcalco ruin. The inscription is on the carved or molded face of a brick. Comalcalco is unusual among Mayan temples in that it was constructed of bricks.
Arturo Mendez, a spokesman for the institute, said the fragment of inscription had been discovered years ago and has been subject to thorough study. It is not on display and is being kept in storage at the institute.
The "Comalcalco Brick," as the second fragment is known, has been discussed by experts in some online forums. Many still doubt that it is a definite reference to Dec. 21, 2012 or Dec. 23, 2012, the dates cited by proponents of the theory as the possible end of the world.
"Some have proposed it as another reference to 2012, but I remain rather unconvinced," David Stuart, a specialist in Mayan epigraphy at the University of Texas at Austin, said in a message to The Associated Press.
Stuart said the date inscribed on the brick "'is a Calendar Round,' a combination of a day and month position that will repeat every 52 years."
The brick date does coincide with the end of the 13th Baktun; Baktuns were roughly 394-year periods and 13 was a significant, sacred number for the Mayas. The Mayan Long Count calendar begins in 3114 B.C., and the 13th Baktun ends around Dec. 21, 2012.
But the date on the brick could also correspond to similar dates in the past, Stuart said.
"There's no reason it couldn't be also a date in ancient times, describing some important historical event in the Classic period. In fact, the third glyph on the brick seems to read as the verb huli, "he/she/it arrives."
"There's no future tense marking (unlike the Tortuguero phrase), which in my mind points more to the Comalcalco date being more historical that prophetic," Stuart wrote.
Both inscriptions - the Tortuguero tablet and the Comalcalco brick - were probably carved about 1,300 years ago and both are cryptic in some ways.
The Tortuguero inscription describes something that is supposed to occur in 2012 involving Bolon Yokte, a mysterious Mayan god associated with both war and creation.
However, erosion and a crack in the stone make the end of the passage almost illegible, though some read the last eroded glyphs as perhaps saying, "He will descend from the sky."
The Comalcalco brick is also odd in that the molded or inscribed faces of the bricks were probably laid facing inward or covered with stucco, suggesting they were not meant to be seen.
The Institute of Anthropology and History has long said rumors of a world-ending or world-changing event in late December 2012 are a Westernized misinterpretation of Mayan calendars.
The institute repeated Thursday that "western messianic thought has twisted the cosmovision of ancient civilizations like the Maya."
The institute's experts say the Mayas saw time as a series of cycles that began and ended with regularity, but with nothing apocalyptic at the end of a given cycle.
Given the strength of Internet rumors about impending disaster in 2012, the institute is organizing a special round table of 60 Mayan experts next week at the archaeological site of Palenque, in southern Mexico, to "dispel some of the doubts about the end of one era and the beginning of another, in the Mayan Long Count calendar."
©2011 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
-
From lemons to lemonade: Reaction uses carbon dioxide to make carbon-based semiconductor,
32 comments
-
Thioridazine kills cancer stem cells in human while avoiding toxic side-effects of conventional cancer treatments,
3 comments
-
SpaceX private rocket blasts off for space station (Update),
42 comments
-
Climate scientists say they have solved riddle of rising sea,
31 comments
-
SpaceX capsule has 'new car' smell, astronauts say (Update),
4 comments
-
What would stain as translucent on light-coloured fabric?
May 26, 2012
-
How do I identify different bacteria on culture plates?
May 26, 2012
-
Why Do Dogs do Strange things...
May 25, 2012
-
What does exophillic and endophillic mean in terms of mosquito and their control?
May 24, 2012
-
Semen stains glows under black lights (uv light)?
May 23, 2012
-
Question on Human Chromosome 2
May 23, 2012
- More from Physics Forums - Biology
More news stories
Change in developmental timing was crucial in the evolutionary shift from dinosaurs to birds: study
At first glance, it's hard to see how a common house sparrow and a Tyrannosaurus Rex might have anything in common. After all, one is a bird that weighs less than an ounce, and the other is a dinosaur that ...
Other Sciences / Archaeology & Fossils
4 hours ago |
5 / 5 (2) |
0
|
Social welfare cuts ultimately come with heavy price, researchers say
(Phys.org) -- Slashing government funding for Medicaid, food stamps and other programs that serve the poor while politically popular with some lawmakers and many conservatives may do more harm ...
Other Sciences / Social Sciences
May 24, 2012 |
4.3 / 5 (16) |
154
Ancient Bethlehem seal unearthed in Jerusalem
Israeli archaeologists have discovered a 2,700-year-old seal that bears the inscription "Bethlehem," the Israel Antiquities Authority announced Wednesday, in what experts believe to be the oldest artifact ...
Other Sciences / Archaeology & Fossils
May 23, 2012 |
3.5 / 5 (14) |
24
Dollars and sense: Why are some people morally against tax?
As the U.S. presidential election campaigns heat up, the economic debate is dominated by bailouts, austerity and, inevitably, taxation. Now a new study published in Symbolic Interaction asks why tax is such an important issue ...
Other Sciences / Social Sciences
May 23, 2012 |
3 / 5 (2) |
15
Oldest Jewish archaeological evidence on the Iberian Peninsula
German archaeologists of the Friedrich Schiller University Jena found one of the oldest archaeological evidence so far of Jewish Culture on the Iberian Peninsula at an excavation site in the south of Portugal, ...
Other Sciences / Archaeology & Fossils
May 25, 2012 |
4.2 / 5 (6) |
12
Nvidia trumpets Tegra 3 phone design wins for 2012
(Phys.org) -- Nvidias competitive war paint has a name, Tegra 3. On the heels of Nvidia announcements about lowering costs of its Tegra 3 processors and Nvidia-enabled tablets running Android Ice Cream ...
'Unzipped' carbon nanotubes could help energize fuel cells, batteries
Multi-walled carbon nanotubes riddled with defects and impurities on the outside could replace some of the expensive platinum catalysts used in fuel cells and metal-air batteries, according to scientists at ...
T cells 'hunt' parasites like animal predators seek prey, study shows
By pairing an intimate knowledge of immune-system function with a deep understanding of statistical physics, a cross-disciplinary team at the University of Pennsylvania has arrived at a surprising finding: T cells use a movement ...
Computer model used to pinpoint prime materials for efficient carbon capture
When power plants begin capturing their carbon emissions to reduce greenhouse gases and to most in the electric power industry, it's a question of when, not if it will be an expensive undertaking.
Land and sea species differ in climate change response: study
(Phys.org) -- Marine and terrestrial species will likely differ in their responses to climate warming, new research by Simon Fraser University and Australia’s University of Tasmania has found.
Scientist: Evolution debate will soon be history
(AP) -- Richard Leakey predicts skepticism over evolution will soon be history. Not that the avowed atheist has any doubts himself.
Nov 25, 2011
Rank: 2.5 / 5 (8)
or something....
Nov 25, 2011
Rank: 3.7 / 5 (12)
Nov 25, 2011
Rank: 3.3 / 5 (7)
Nov 25, 2011
Rank: 3.4 / 5 (5)
Nov 25, 2011
Rank: 4.3 / 5 (6)
Nov 25, 2011
Rank: 4.3 / 5 (6)
Nov 25, 2011
Rank: 1.9 / 5 (11)
Nov 25, 2011
Rank: 5 / 5 (3)
Its all just a bunch of assumptions used as a basis for an axiom that then is used to calculate to year 2012.
Nov 25, 2011
Rank: 3.7 / 5 (6)
Nov 25, 2011
Rank: 2.2 / 5 (13)
Nov 25, 2011
Rank: 3.7 / 5 (3)
For without a full understanding of how the Maya really thought and how they gained the knowledge that caused them to create these stories and without fully understanding the intent of the story we are only guessing and the more imaginative or the more erratic the reader is the wilder the meanings they create. If we were able to fully understand the Maya we may find that these enigmatic pieces tell part of a mundane story relevant only to the Maya and based upon the concept that they and their society would continue forever.
Let us continue our holiday plans for 2013 and beyond.
Nov 26, 2011
Rank: 1 / 5 (9)
Nov 26, 2011
Rank: 1 / 5 (52)
Oxford says otherwise.
Nov 26, 2011
Rank: 5 / 5 (7)
their whole religion was set up for one event. when the earth aligns with galactic central and their souls can go to their version of heaven.
so reminds me of the turn of 2,000. the world didn't end then, and it sure won't end now.
Nov 26, 2011
Rank: 5 / 5 (11)
Nov 26, 2011
Rank: 1 / 5 (1)
Nov 26, 2011
Rank: 4.5 / 5 (8)
Nov 26, 2011
Rank: not rated yet
What do you think the outcome of a fight between a bunch of nerds and scientists against blood-thirsty barbarians would be? It's hypothetical of course, but you should get the point. As society became civilized to a certain point, the population is ill-equipped mentally to fight a total war to the death.
Nov 26, 2011
Rank: 5 / 5 (1)
Nov 26, 2011
Rank: 3 / 5 (4)
They're still around, Max, at least the descendants of those who survived the smallpox, influenza, and other diseases brought to them by the Spaniards. Same with the Aztec descendants. . . .and the Maori of N.Z. and Aborigines of Oz survived the invasions of the British also. Can't keep a good man down, you know, just because they don't have anymore fight left in them. They persevere. . . .waiting for just the right moment.
@Ricochet. . . .your god seems to have abandoned you Jews. . .that's IF he ever existed. Ask almost anyone on Physorg. They will want complete EVIDENCE of your god. And if you can't provide any except a book, then there is no such thing as a "chosen people". Sorry, but your bible is a fantasy.
Nov 27, 2011
Rank: not rated yet
..eh ?
Nov 27, 2011
Rank: not rated yet
Who knows? Perhaps they knew from their readings of (whatever) that their time is coming to an end, accepted it and let it happen as true adherents of unavoidable workings of the universe? To use a more modern analogy, it is pointless to spit upwind! :-)
Nov 27, 2011
Rank: 5 / 5 (3)
Step 1: procure a large rock. The bigger, the better.
Step 2: carve some scary, half-coherent pictures and other nonsense in it. Provide suitable future chronological references in it.
Step 3: Commit suicide. The bloodier, the better.
Ok, now heres the one they prepared earlier...
Nov 28, 2011
Rank: 1 / 5 (2)
Whoever or whatever it is, it arrives in 2012. Sounds like fun times.
Sometimes I get the impression that the Mayans were visited by evil aliens who warned of their return in the distant future.
Nov 28, 2011
Rank: not rated yet
p.s. the maya had already nearly died out by the time the spanish came along. their empire had dissolved into several smaller city-states.
Nov 28, 2011
Rank: 5 / 5 (1)
Not fantasy, but the science fiction of the time... Religions were designed to explain the unexplainable to a group of people who couldn't understand what was going on. Don't think I'm blind to the falacies of religion, but also know that I do believe in a "God" of sorts. But what I believe It is, is my own belief. What's nice about Judaism is the fact that it encourages everyone to define God in whatever way feels right to themselves, and not a pre-cut slice of dogma.
So now, here's my definition of "God", which precludes its existence, and defines how it could never abandone anyone. Tell me if by my definition, that "God" doesn't exist...
Since I'm out of characters, see my next pos
Nov 28, 2011
Rank: 3 / 5 (2)
First, I see God as a genderless entity. By entity, I don't think of it as a singular being that runs things, but more like an aspect of reality. I find "God" as being a convenient term to define the energy, whatever it may be, that enables us to "be", which is, to be self-aware, live, etc.
I believe that when you stop referring to "God" as a being, but as a thing, then you start to understand what they were trying to say way back then.
Nov 28, 2011
Rank: not rated yet
Nov 28, 2011
Rank: 1 / 5 (1)
Nov 28, 2011
Rank: 1 / 5 (7)
Your usual nonsense. Of course, you usually throw in a verified fact or two. Not this time. Of course, you're not to blame for making up crapola sandwiches (this time), just passing them around.
There was never any such speech, nor any such reference. Below is a link wherein Bill Moyers, nationally syndicated columnist who mistakenly published the information about Watt, apologizes publicly to Watt for not doing his research.
It seems you owe all of us a similar apology.
http://www.freere...86/posts
Nov 28, 2011
Rank: 1.6 / 5 (7)
Nov 28, 2011
Rank: 3.7 / 5 (3)
Nov 29, 2011
Rank: not rated yet
Nov 29, 2011
Rank: not rated yet
-Along with many other things.A thing, as in a very useful sociopolitical expedient. A manifestation of superstitious Wünschtraume. That sort of thing.Who said the Priest-Kings who devised the calendar ever died out? Mesoamerican civilizations were tailor-made for efficient conquest by euro invaders. This was done within a generation and involved a third of their estimated GDP. For no apparent reason.
The same Priesthood still constructs our societies for us and Plans when they rise and fall. Perhaps there is a grand Plan which ends next year?
Nov 29, 2011
Rank: not rated yet
If that doesn't work for you, try this: https://www.googl...nspiracy theories
Nov 29, 2011
Rank: 5 / 5 (2)
Agreed, what the hell is the deal with the unfounded reverence for ancient cultures? Most people in America at least couldn't tell you a damn thing about modern science but have no problem considering people who lived many thousands of years ago as some kind of geniuses.
Nov 29, 2011
Rank: 5 / 5 (2)
Then again, the way our culture is going, in 2600, they'll know exactly how to view them, and wonder to themselves, "This is what they call hardcore?! Frak! I'd show that to my kids!"
Nov 29, 2011
Rank: not rated yet
-We know so little about the culture. As Richard feynman pointed out, out of the 1000s of books originally found, the conquistadors burnt all but 3. Greece did in fact have a 'central state'; the oracle at delphi.
"The ancient people of the Mediterranean had such faith in Pythia's view of the future that no major decision was made without consulting the Oracle of Delphi first. Greek and foreign dignitaries, heads of state, and common folk made the pilgrimage to the Delphi sanctuary, and paid great sums for Pythia's oracles."
-The young oracle would drool and babble and her priests would tell the clientele this meant apollo wanted athens to ally with thebes against sparta etc.
cont==>
Nov 29, 2011
Rank: not rated yet
The oracle existed for 1500 years. The pope inherited her soothsaying powers and the power to guide euro dynasties, alliances, and wars. City-states became kingdoms, and these became nation-states.
Was a mayan priesthood similarly centralized?
"The upper echelon of the priesthood was a repository of learning, also in the field of history and genealogical knowledge. Around 1500, the Yucatec priesthood was hierarchically organized, from the high priest living at the court down to the priests in the towns, and the priestly books were distributed along these lines."
-Apparently so.
Nov 29, 2011
Rank: not rated yet
Cooperation in the defeat of mutual enemies occurs at every level of human interaction. We see it on the playground, on the streets, in business, politics, crime, sports. We have learned to expect it at every level in society but we believe that at the highest level of interaction there can be nothing but anarchy. Why?
The oracular priests knew that conflicts would resolve themselves when the people who instigated them were dead. It was not the conflict which was the problem but the growth of populations that caused it.
Priest kings knew also that the people would inevitably blame their hardship on them, no matter how benevolent they tried to be. They realized that this made the people the true enemies of leaders everywhere, and that the most effective way of defeating them was to set them against one another.
This new meme spread among Leaders worldwide.
Nov 29, 2011
Rank: not rated yet
Nov 29, 2011
Rank: not rated yet
Consider if trade with independent euro and african merchants had given them the use of metallurgy, gunpowder, horses, ocean navigation, etc. Consider what american drugs and precious metals would have done to existing power structures throughout the Old World, if they had arrived without strict control by Those already in Charge.
But they didnt. Through many strange and inexplicable developments and disappearances in the New World, the cultures rapidly collapsed and the threat evaporated. And most of the people DIED.
This is VICTORY. I dont see how it all could have happened without Preparation.
Nov 30, 2011
Rank: 1 / 5 (1)