As climate talks sputter, UN scientists vet 'Plan B'
June 18, 2011 by Marlowe Hood
On the heels of another halting round of talks on climate change, UN scientists this week will review quick-fix options for beating back the threat of global warming that rely on technology rather than political wrangling.
Experts from the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), meeting for three days from Monday in the Peruvian capital Lima, will ponder "geo-engineering" solutions designed to cool the planet, or at least brake the startling rise in Earth's temperature.
Seeding the ocean with iron, scattering heat-reflecting particles in the stratosphere, building towers to suck carbon dioxide (CO2) out of the atmosphere, and erecting a giant sunshade in space are all on the examining table.
Critics say such schemes -- some of which have been tested experimentally -- are a roll of the dice with Earth's climate system and its complex web of biodiversity.
And even if one problem is solved, they argue, it may be impossible to anticipate knock-on effects and unintended consequences.
There is a political danger as well, climate policy experts caution: the prospect of a quick fix to global warming could weaken an already fragile global consensus on the need to reduce greenhouse gases or subvert complicated methods for measuring emissions cuts.
"It's a convenient way for Northern governments to dodge their commitments to emissions reduction," said Silvia Ribeiro of the ETC Group, a technology watchdog group.
Last week, more than 100 organisations, including ETC and Friends of the Earth, sent an open letter to the IPCC "demanding a clear statement of its commitment to precaution and to the existing international moratorium on geo-engineering."
Only four years ago, in its landmark Fourth Assessment Report, the IPCC dismissed geo-engineering in a brief aside as charged with potential risk and unquantified cost.
But now the Nobel-winning panel is taking a closer look, a telling sign, for some, that the effort to tackle global warming through politics is taking too long and bearing too little fruit.
Delegates ended another 12-day talkfest in Bonn on Friday under the UN Framework Convention on Climate Change (UNFCCC), still deeply riven over who should cut their emissions, by how much and when.
Current pledges fall far short of holding temperature rise in check below 2.0 degree Celsius (3.6 degrees Fahrenheit) compared with pre-industrial levels, a widely accepted threshold for safety.
IPCC officials defend the new review on several grounds.
To begin with, it is what members of the 194-nation intergovernmental body asked for, said Jean-Pascal van Ypersele, a leading Belgian scientist and vice chair of the IPCC.
"My concern is to fulfill an IPCC mandate to provide the best information available to take informed decisions to protect the climate and the environment," he said by telephone.
"We will look at the advantages and possibilities, but we will also look at the potentially negative aspects."
The experts meeting Monday, he added, review the state of scientific knowledge but do not make policy recommendations.
"In the absence of an objective IPCC assessment, the only information available to policy makers would be from quite a diverse range of sources, some of which might have an interest at stake," he said.
Geo-engineering schemes can be as simple as planting trees to absorb CO2 or painting flat roofs white to reflect sunlight back into space, a technique already in use in many sun-baked urban settings.
They also include scattering sea salt aerosols in low marine clouds to render them more mirror-like, sowing the stratosphere with reflective sulphate particles, or "fertilising" the ocean surface with iron to spur the growth of micro-organisms that gobble up CO2.
At the sci-fi end of the scale is a proposal -- which exists, for now, only on paper -- for a sunshade positioned at a key point between Earth and the Sun that would deflect one or two percent of solar radiation, turning the planet's thermostat down a notch.
In an analysis published in September 2009, the Royal Society, Britain's academy of sciences, judged that planting forests and building towers to capture CO2 could make a useful contribution -- once they are demonstrated to be "safe, effective, sustainable and affordable."
It also noted that blunting the impact of solar radiation would still not lower atmospheric concentrations of CO2, which is also driving ocean acidification.
(c) 2011 AFP
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Jun 18, 2011
Rank: 1.8 / 5 (17)
Most of the Canadian and American rust belts have not had ONE single smog day in over FIVE YEARS. (only constant reports of "ALERTS" to a potential of a smog warning/day developing)
I'm not the only one contacting authorities and law makers and the justice departments to have the leading scientists and NEWS EDITORS charged for this needless panic of a false war called Climate Change. We missed getting Bush. We need a Nuremberg Trial again.
Jun 18, 2011
Rank: 2 / 5 (16)
And the unconscionable media and greedy lab coat consultants were a part of this needles panic and climate crime that condemned billions of children to a CO2 death, JUST to get them to turn the lights out more often. Now climate change has done to journalism and science what abusive priests did for the Catholic Church.
Nice job JOURNALISTS. Nice job SCIENTISTS.
Jun 18, 2011
Rank: 4.1 / 5 (9)
1) The Earth is not warming
2) CO2 has no effect on the temperature of the Earth
3) A warmer Earth will not have changes that raise sea level
4) More water vapor in the atmosphere means more energy and drives the heat engine of the earth faster
5) Arctic ice melt is accelerating
What is your opinion of the statements above, please give me a reference.
These things are happening slowly. Causal relationships are also being developed slowly and carefully (they might not be tied together). They might be too slow for most to even notice.
The process for humanely cooking lobster is to put them in cold water and slowly raise the temperature. By the time it gets hot enough to cook them they have acclimated and they die quickly during the next few degrees. I am not in favor of the hysterical claims of the extremists on either side of the argument but please just give me references to your answers to the questions above.
Jun 18, 2011
Rank: 2.5 / 5 (13)
Jun 18, 2011
Rank: 3.7 / 5 (3)
http://www.physor...ots.html
Are you saying that the clearly worded discovery here has been translated by you to mean that we are about to drop into a cooling mode? Can you please support that claim (which I consider as irresponsible as those who claim we are going to burst into flames in 20 years). :-)
Jun 18, 2011
Rank: 3 / 5 (7)
Its like giving a machine gun to an idiot child. Paul Ehrlich (mentor of John Cook of the SkepticalScience blog, author of "Climate Change Denial")
Clean-burning, non-polluting, hydrogen-using bulldozers still could knock down trees or build housing developments on farmland. Paul Ciotti (LA Times)
It gives some people the false hope that there are no limits to growth and no environmental price to be paid by having unlimited sources of energy. Jeremy Rifkin (NY Times)
Many people assume that cheaper, more abundant energy will mean that mankind is better off, but there is no evidence for that. Laura Nader (sister of Ralph)
Jun 18, 2011
Rank: 2.1 / 5 (7)
Of course it is. With no trend up-swing that doesn't have perfect precedence before CO2 was a big deal:
http://oi56.tinyp...h021.jpg
http://oi45.tinyp...bajo.jpg
Not even GISS, the steepest global average of all shows any warming in the last decade or so:
http://www.woodfo...02/trend
2) CO2 has no effect on the temperature of the Earth
Only pedantic eccentrics claim this, not serious skeptics. Such claims are based on pages of equations without matching empirical evidence.
Jun 18, 2011
Rank: 1.8 / 5 (5)
3) A warmer Earth will not have changes that raise sea level
Sea level shows no contemporary trend change whatsoever. Church and White, the classic purveyors of an exponentially shaped sea level curve, in their latest article update of 2011 (which eliminated the word accelerating from the title) plots, in hard-to-see yellow, a simple average of tide gauges, which, once I clean all the dark plots behind it away, shows stark linearity.
Graph: http://oi51.tinyp...koix.jpg
Reference: http://www.spring...text.pdf
http://oi53.tinyp...os4y.jpg
Jun 18, 2011
Rank: 1.8 / 5 (5)
Huh? More water vapor gives more low level clouds which reflect sunlight. That's the unknown factor, so far, though Lindzen's recent update to his originally flawed paper on measuring actual feedbacks will help clear this up, either way.
5) Arctic ice melt is accelerating
Yup! The 10% of the world's ice up there is doing something interesting. And rapidly recovering now too. However, the 90% of the world's ice at the other pole is growing, since that continent is in fact cooling according to the UAH satellite:
http://oi54.tinyp...es9e.jpg
http://oi51.tinyp...cor5.jpg
Jun 18, 2011
Rank: 5 / 5 (1)
"Sea level shows no contemporary trend change whatsoever. Church and White, the classic purveyors of an exponentially shaped sea level curve, in their latest article update of 2011 (which eliminated the word accelerating from the title) plots, in hard-to-see yellow, a simple average of tide gauges, which, once I clean all the dark plots behind it away, shows stark linearity."
I leave it to the readers to go to his reference to Church and White to see what they have actually written. It is not clear to me where the "tinypictures" which are loaded up to an anonymous web site even come from. Please let us know where they come from. Please re-read the paper you gave us.
Jun 18, 2011
Rank: 5 / 5 (4)
Jun 18, 2011
Rank: 2.3 / 5 (9)
1. Former proponents of the UN's global warming story, like Mark Lynas, are asking the UN's IPCC to answer pointed questions:
www.marklynas.org...-answer/
2. First-class climatologists are moving away from global climate claims by Al Gore and the UN's IPCC:
http://judithcurr...-review/
3. Wind mills are being exposed as dangerous and unreliable energy generators
http://windconcer...utshell/
The story of CO2-induced global warming is coming apart at the seams.
With kind regards,
Oliver K. Manuel
Former NASA Principal
Investigator for Apollo
Jun 18, 2011
Rank: 5 / 5 (2)
Jun 19, 2011
Rank: 5 / 5 (1)
Jun 19, 2011
Rank: 5 / 5 (4)
Jun 19, 2011
Rank: 1.7 / 5 (6)
It doesn't matter.
The entire story of CO2-Induced Global Warming AGW) is now falling apart.
www.marklynas.org...-answer/
Jun 19, 2011
Rank: 4.2 / 5 (5)
Jun 19, 2011
Rank: 2.3 / 5 (3)
It's not in ten years they are saying that now as well. Supposedly a repeat of the mini ice age.
Jun 19, 2011
Rank: 5 / 5 (1)
Where do you get this startling information? Please show any scientific papers or reputable scientific source that are saying this. A reference for such a statement would be appropriate. My bet is that you can't find any source other than Rush or FoxNews. Every measure shows the Earth warming since the last ice age. Every scientific prediction shows it continuing to warm. Now we have a single paper predicting a sun spot minimum (which has not been proven) and you are saying we are in a repeat of a mini ice age. Please show your work and give us your references for this unfounded claim.
Jun 19, 2011
Rank: 1 / 5 (1)
The truth is often shrouded in doublespeak. For instance, NOAA routinely proclaims: "the (X)th warmest such period on record(!)" but generally don't bother to state the described period is substantially cooler than the previous year(s).
That is, if we go from having the warmest year on record to subsequent years which are less than the warmest such value, then hasn't it actually been cooler? Why don't they say that?
http://www.ncdc.n.../global/
And by stating:
...aren't they really saying something like, "Wow! The southern hemisphere has really cooled off this year!"
Why does all their language and graphics relate everthing to "warmest?" Why not relate it all to coolest? Isn't that equally objective?
Jun 20, 2011
Rank: 1.8 / 5 (5)
You may be right. I don't think so.
Neither do many well-known scientists:
R. W. Fairbridge and J. H. Shirley, Prolonged minima and the 179-yr cycle of the solar
inertial motion, Solar Physics 110 (1987) 191-220.
H. Svensmark, Cosmic rays and Earths climate, Space Science Reviews (2000)
1555-1666.
O. K. Manuel, B. W. Ninham and S. E. Friberg, Superfluidity in the solar interior:
Implications for solar eruptions and climate, Journal of Fusion Energy 21 (2002) 193-198.
T. Landscheidt, "New Little Ice Age instead of Global Warming?, Energy & Environment 114 (2003) 327-350.
S. Yousef, 80-120 yr long-term solar induced effects on the Earth: Past and predictions,
Physics and Chemistry of the Earth 31 (2006) 113-122.
J. Shirley, Axial rotation, orbital revolution and solar spin-orbit coupling, Monthly
Notices of the Royal Astronomical Society 368 (2006) 280-282.
Etc.
Jun 20, 2011
Rank: 4.2 / 5 (5)
Jun 20, 2011
Rank: 4 / 5 (2)
As your example, you use: "The average Southern Hemisphere land surface temperature for the year to date tied with 1994 as the 26th warmest JanuaryMay on record while the ocean surface temperature tied with 1983 as 11th warmest."
If they were to use your approach of looking at it from the cold side (since the records on the page you point to for your reference uses 1880 as the base) they would have to say it was approximately (because I don't know the number of ties) the 110th coldest since recording began in 1880. To me it seems that talking about what it is close to (warmest) makes more sense than talking about what it is farthest from (coldest). Either way it is very far from coldest and not too far from warmest. How do you want it? Either way it was warm.
Jun 20, 2011
Rank: 2 / 5 (5)
For instance, couldn't they simply state: "The average Southern Hemisphere land surface temperature for the year to date tied with 1994." and: "The ocean surface temperature tied with 1983."
That they don't bother to report the dramatic cooling, and rather appear to go out of their way to avoid using the word "cooling," appears particularly telling of their bias.
Jun 20, 2011
Rank: 1 / 5 (4)
T. Landscheidt, "New Little Ice Age instead of Global Warming?, Energy & Environment 114 (2003) 327-350.
With kind regards,
Oliver K. Manuel
Jun 20, 2011
Rank: 3.7 / 5 (3)
Why are you posting the same thing in every article? Wanna stop needlessly posting off topic opinions and rather comment on the article?
Reported for spamming.
Jun 20, 2011
Rank: 2.3 / 5 (3)
Jul 01, 2011
Rank: 5 / 5 (1)
Just FYI, the NOAA record go back 116 years, to about 1895. The records prior to something like 1970, whenever NOAA was formed, were kept by the Commerce Department. Those early records were never meant to be used for climate study in the manner we now use them. Any good researcher knows that you can't trust data that you didn't collect for yourself, and especially when it was taken for some other purpose.
Jul 02, 2011
Rank: 1.8 / 5 (5)
http://www.guardi...P=twt_fd
Mann, too, tried to keep is hockey stick data proprietary.
Jul 02, 2011
Rank: 1 / 5 (3)
Thanks, ryggesogn2, for the information.
As the climate scandal unfolds, Science has even started to be receptive to comments from climate skeptics on the damage inflicted by the scandal of CO2-induced global warming:
www.sciencenews.o...ientists
The scoundrels that led us into this mess may not know how to get out of it.
So hang in there!
Oliver K. Manuel
Jul 02, 2011
Rank: not rated yet
Having said that, it will be interesting to have those getting the data subject to the same scrutiny that they have given the UEA. We should see their results soon after they get the data since they have been running sample data bases for a few years. I can't wait to see both their results and their methods. I will also be interested in how they "cull" the data (based on their stated preference for specific weather stations). Now they can make their results, approach, and algorithms public and subject to review.
Jul 02, 2011
Rank: 1 / 5 (2)
Me too. That is all that we asked.
Instead of releasing data to verify CO2-induced global warming,
a.) Scary films [1] were made and given to schools as "scientific facts."
b.) The tailpipe of the once-thriving Western economy was pinched off.
c.) Government-paid scientists claimed the public had no right to see the data.
The data - if actually released - will either confirm that:
a.) CO2 causes global warming [1], or
b.) The Sun causes climate change [2].
I strongly suspect that the data will confirm [2].
References:
1. "An Inconvenient Truth" by Al Gore
www.climatecrisis.net/
2. "Earth's Heat Source - The Sun", Energy and Environment 20, 131-144 (2009)
http://arxiv.org/pdf/0905.0704
Jul 05, 2011
Rank: not rated yet
That isn't likely. Contrary views are not usually published and when legitemate problems are found with published studies after they have passed peer review, corrections are rarely made. Mann just released a sea level study with some really obvious short-comings, including a reference to one of his own previous studies which also had some serious problems. Neither the current nor previous study will ever be corrected. That's just one high profile example. There are many others. This is just my opinion, but the recent trend in Journals towards rapid publication doesn't seem to be working very well. It's great if you're trying to influence a political situation, but it isn't good science. The suplementary journals which have a mix of peer review and non-peer reviewed material are even worse. Editorials in journals? Hmmmm.